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Posted to users@tomcat.apache.org by J ANDERSEN <j_...@btinternet.com> on 2008/06/18 15:25:25 UTC
Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
I am trying to get Tomcat to work (Linux, 64 bits) - it runs fine, I can connect to localhost:8080, but no matter what I have tried, there doesn't seem to be any applications. It is probably just a question of find the right place to set things up, but where?
I have tried to follow the user guide, http://tomcat.apache.org/tomcat-5.5-doc/index.html, but to no avail, I'm afraid. Also, what is the default administrator and password supposed to be?
Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by Christopher Schultz <ch...@christopherschultz.net>.
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Hash: SHA1
J,
J ANDERSEN wrote:
| I am trying to get Tomcat to work (Linux, 64 bits) - it runs fine, I
| can connect to localhost:8080, but no matter what I have tried, there
| doesn't seem to be any applications. It is probably just a question
| of find the right place to set things up, but where?
Where have you installed Tomcat? What applications do you expect to see?
Generally, there is a "webapps" directory where you can place a WAR file
and have it deployed when you start Tomcat.
| I have tried to follow the user guide,
| http://tomcat.apache.org/tomcat-5.5-doc/index.html, but to no avail,
| I'm afraid. Also, what is the default administrator and password
| supposed to be?
In a clean install, the passwords are set in the
$TOMCAT_HOME/conf/tomcat-users.xml file. You can edit the file with your
favorite text editor to set the password to whatever you'd like. This
file is referenced in the $TOMCAT_HOME/conf/server.xml file, and may be
commented-out (you'll have to uncomment it and restart Tomcat to enable it).
The server.xml file has /tons/ of comments explaining what each thing is
doing. Consider reading through it if you have some time.
- -chris
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Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by André Warnier <aw...@ice-sa.com>.
J ANDERSEN wrote:
> I am trying to get Tomcat to work (Linux, 64 bits) - it runs fine, I can connect to localhost:8080, but no matter what I have tried, there doesn't seem to be any applications. It is probably just a question of find the right place to set things up, but where?
>
> I have tried to follow the user guide, http://tomcat.apache.org/tomcat-5.5-doc/index.html, but to no avail, I'm afraid. Also, what is the default administrator and password supposed to be?
>
Glad to see a question at my level in this list, for once.
Assuming your config is fairly standard, you should find a file
"tomcat-users.xml" somewhere (in a "/conf" directory ?). That's
probably where the admin user is defined.
About the first question, can you tell us how you installed this Tomcat,
and under which flavor of Linux you're installing it ?
Maybe the applications are just another package, which you have not
installed ?
(Look for tomcat-webapps or tomcat-examples or similar.)
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Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by jan <j_...@btinternet.com>.
Um, wow.
To answere summarily to everybody here - I did in fact install a
repackaged version, one on Gentoo, one on Ubuntu, and in both cases I
could easily get something up and running, but I couldn't get anything
else to work. So I removed them and installed the one I downloaded from
the Tomcat website - I found out in the end that I hadn't got rid of the
repackaged version from memory, not quite sure why. Once I sorted that
out it worked. Thanks for your help.
/jan
Steve Ochani wrote:
> Date sent: Wed, 18 Jun 2008 17:17:07 +0200
> From: André Warnier <aw...@ice-sa.com>
> Subject: Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
> To: Tomcat Users List <us...@tomcat.apache.org>
> Send reply to: Tomcat Users List <us...@tomcat.apache.org>
>
>> Caldarale, Charles R wrote:
>>>> From: "J ANDERSEN" <j_...@btinternet.com>
>>>> Subject: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
>>>>
>>>> I am trying to get Tomcat to work (Linux, 64 bits) - it runs
>>>> fine, I can connect to localhost:8080, but no matter what I
>>>> have tried, there doesn't seem to be any applications.
>>> Did you install a real Tomcat from http://tomcat.apache.org, or are
>>> you using a 3rd-party repackaged piece of junk? If the latter,
>>> throw it away and get the real one. Most, if not all, of the
>>> repackaged versions simply don't work and do not conform to the
>>> expected installation structure.
>>>
>> To the original poster : please ignore the comment above.
>> Chuck ssems to have something viscerally against any packaged form of
>> Tomcat, or any Tomcat that is not the very latest version.
>
> Yes because what he wrote above is true.
>
> I myself have tried the packaged version of tomcat on two recent distros of Linux and they
> are not worth using.
>
> I've also been mostly a lurker on this list for quite a while and I have seen countless no. of
> people having trouble with packaged versions of tomcat and as soon as they downloaded
> and started using the "real" version of Tomcat their troubles went away.
>
>
> If the user is not able to replace their version of Tomcat then they should consider asking
> support from their distro support lines. For ex. someone from Ubuntu posted here several
> months ago that the users of this list should send anyone having trouble with the Ubuntu
> packaged version of tomcat over to their support forums.
>
>
> -Steve O.
>
>
>
>
>> He seems
>> to be unable to understand and accept that many Tomcat users and
>> system admins simply do not have much choice in the matter, and that
>> Tomcat does not exist in a void by its own, but is usually part of an
>> environment with many constraints other than Tomcat. And he wants to
>> ignore the fact that there are tens of thousands of Tomcats out there
>> installed from packages, working fine, and easy to run and maintain;
>> and dozens of qualified and benevolent software packagers, who do
>> their best to provide packages working in a given environment. It is a
>> real pity, because he undoubtedly knows his Tomcat and Java stuff
>> better than most. And usually, after this first rash comment, he
>> starts actually trying to help. There are others on this list that
>> will try to help you if you just want help with the Tomcat you got.
>>
>> André
>>
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Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by Steve Ochani <oc...@ncc.edu>.
Date sent: Wed, 18 Jun 2008 17:17:07 +0200
From: André Warnier <aw...@ice-sa.com>
Subject: Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
To: Tomcat Users List <us...@tomcat.apache.org>
Send reply to: Tomcat Users List <us...@tomcat.apache.org>
>
> Caldarale, Charles R wrote:
> >> From: "J ANDERSEN" <j_...@btinternet.com>
> >> Subject: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
> >>
> >> I am trying to get Tomcat to work (Linux, 64 bits) - it runs
> >> fine, I can connect to localhost:8080, but no matter what I
> >> have tried, there doesn't seem to be any applications.
> >
> > Did you install a real Tomcat from http://tomcat.apache.org, or are
> > you using a 3rd-party repackaged piece of junk? If the latter,
> > throw it away and get the real one. Most, if not all, of the
> > repackaged versions simply don't work and do not conform to the
> > expected installation structure.
> >
> To the original poster : please ignore the comment above.
> Chuck ssems to have something viscerally against any packaged form of
> Tomcat, or any Tomcat that is not the very latest version.
Yes because what he wrote above is true.
I myself have tried the packaged version of tomcat on two recent distros of Linux and they
are not worth using.
I've also been mostly a lurker on this list for quite a while and I have seen countless no. of
people having trouble with packaged versions of tomcat and as soon as they downloaded
and started using the "real" version of Tomcat their troubles went away.
If the user is not able to replace their version of Tomcat then they should consider asking
support from their distro support lines. For ex. someone from Ubuntu posted here several
months ago that the users of this list should send anyone having trouble with the Ubuntu
packaged version of tomcat over to their support forums.
-Steve O.
> He seems
> to be unable to understand and accept that many Tomcat users and
> system admins simply do not have much choice in the matter, and that
> Tomcat does not exist in a void by its own, but is usually part of an
> environment with many constraints other than Tomcat. And he wants to
> ignore the fact that there are tens of thousands of Tomcats out there
> installed from packages, working fine, and easy to run and maintain;
> and dozens of qualified and benevolent software packagers, who do
> their best to provide packages working in a given environment. It is a
> real pity, because he undoubtedly knows his Tomcat and Java stuff
> better than most. And usually, after this first rash comment, he
> starts actually trying to help. There are others on this list that
> will try to help you if you just want help with the Tomcat you got.
>
> André
>
>
>
>
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Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by André Warnier <aw...@ice-sa.com>.
Caldarale, Charles R wrote:
>> From: André Warnier [mailto:aw@ice-sa.com]
>> Subject: Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
>>
>> And if the average Tomcat user or sysadmin were to install
>> the official Tomcat, they would after that be in front of a
>> nightmare in terms of overall system maintenance, with files
>> that are, from their point of view, "all over the place" and
>> in the "wrong" places.
>
> Please explain how files under the ONE Tomcat directory can be considered to be "all over the place"?
>
One of the wonders of the Internet, is that one never really knows if
the person they are corresponding with, lives on the same or a different
planet.
Not being myself a software packager, I will answer with the little
practical knowledge I have of the matter. I do not always know the why,
and I do not always agree with the how, but I will describe what I find
in my daily practice.
I am an application software developer and occasional software
installer; my customers are generally departments of large companies,
who run many servers. These people work on HP, IBM, Sun, PC systems of
all kinds, with a wide variety of operating systems, of which many
flavours of Unix and Linux; under all of those I regularly install
software (ours and standard software like Apache, Tomcat, Samba, Java,
Perl, OpenSSL, etc.. as needed for the applications).
I would guess that in 95% of the cases, these systems (of which I do not
choose the brand or configuration), have
- startup/shutdown scripts under /etc/init.d or /sbin/init.d
- configuration settings of all packages under /etc
- logfiles under /var/log or /var/adm/log
- software package (sources or binaries) under /opt or /usr
- data and/or applications variously under /var or /usr
And then there is Windows, where things are done differently, but which
also has its interesting variations in terms of "Program
Files"("Archivos de Programa"), "Documents and Settings" ("Dokumente und
Einstellungen") and which call daemons, Services (at least in English).
The variations between platforms are one of those daily inconvenients
that one is facing all the time, but also make life more interesting.
I would also say that on 95% of the machines I have to install software
on, there are, when I arrive, already 50 packages or more installed,
most of which having been installed using the standard software
installation method for that platform. The tools range from SAM to rpm
to apt and msi and several others besides.
Although there are layout differences between platforms, within one
platform it tends to be fairly consistent, and in no case that I recall
does this consistency consist of installing all the files belonging to
each package, under a single root directory dedicated to that package,
be it /usr/local/tomcat5.5 or otherwise.
System administrators in general will strongly insist that, if possible,
I would use the same software installation tool as they use themselves,
and the version of Tomcat that they have in their software repository
for that type of machine, because that allows them in the future to know
what is on their machines, and run patches and updates in a systematic
fashion.
And it is only if I can demonstate to them that the pre-packaged version
of the software they have is not able for some reason to support the
application that the final customer wants, that they will, reluctantly,
allow me to install an "official version".
In which case I will generally also have to spend a lot more time
installing the stuff, because in most cases some pre-requisite will be
missing or be the wrong version for this bleeding-edge piece of software
I need. Recursivity happens often.
And the sysadmin will be peering over my shoulder the whole time, just
to check I am not installing anything nasty. And I will have to pretend
that I understand the message "Variable xyz redeclared with incompatible
type at line 1025 of abc.c" and find a way to fix it.
And it will cost me some extra paperwork, because I will have to write a
"Installationsprotokoll" which explains where things are and how one can
manage this stuff, just because it is different.
And remember, my main purpose is not to install Tomcat, it is to install
an application that requires Tomcat.
And, you know what ? it often bothers me too, that these people would be
so rigid. Because it forces me to learn and understand their packaging
system and it's quirks, and I can't just learn the "official" version of
the package that I use on my own personal development system.
But I understand, when one of these sysadmins tells me that he is
personally in charge of keeping 75 servers alive and well, that he would
prefer some consistency among them, so that he can also sleep at night.
Now you go explain to one of these guys or girls why Tomcat should be
different, and have it's own single root directory all of it's own, with
it's settings and logfiles and software somewhere else, generally
speaking, than the 50 packages already installed.
Let me ask you a question by the way : if all the Tomcat files are under
a single root directory, then why not push this logic a little bit
further, and why even bother splitting that into sub-directories ? Let's
just put all the files directly under /usr/local/tomcat, hardcode this
in the code, and be done with it. Think of all the parameters and specs
one would save. No ?
And another one : In your opinion, out of the thousands of machines
where Tomcat is installed worldwide (I mean on this planet only), what
do you believe is the respective proportion of the ones with an
"official version", as compared to the ones installed from pre-packaged
distributions ? Do you care to make a guess ?
I will now leave it to one of these fairly competent software packagers,
to explain why one puts certain kinds of files under certain directories
or filesystems, in preference to others.
But maybe remember that, of the people that come to this list for
enlightenment and wisdom, probably only a small fraction are developers
who work on their own machine and can choose where they install what on
it, and the majority have to live with what they get.
André
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RE: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by Y Shiva <ju...@yahoo.com>.
And what applications do you expect to see.
--- On Wed, 6/18/08, Caldarale, Charles R <Ch...@unisys.com> wrote:
From: Caldarale, Charles R <Ch...@unisys.com>
Subject: RE: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
To: "Tomcat Users List" <us...@tomcat.apache.org>
Date: Wednesday, June 18, 2008, 9:49 AM
> From: André Warnier [mailto:aw@ice-sa.com]
> Subject: Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
>
> And if the average Tomcat user or sysadmin were to install
> the official Tomcat, they would after that be in front of a
> nightmare in terms of overall system maintenance, with files
> that are, from their point of view, "all over the place" and
> in the "wrong" places.
Please explain how files under the ONE Tomcat directory can be considered to be
"all over the place"?
- Chuck
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RE: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by "Caldarale, Charles R" <Ch...@unisys.com>.
> From: André Warnier [mailto:aw@ice-sa.com]
> Subject: Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
>
> And if the average Tomcat user or sysadmin were to install
> the official Tomcat, they would after that be in front of a
> nightmare in terms of overall system maintenance, with files
> that are, from their point of view, "all over the place" and
> in the "wrong" places.
Please explain how files under the ONE Tomcat directory can be considered to be "all over the place"?
- Chuck
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Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by André Warnier <aw...@ice-sa.com>.
David Smith wrote:
> I hope you feel better having gotten that off your chest.
The truth of
> the matter is that third party packagers do make breaking changes.
I apologise if, in trying to take the defense of some people on this
list, I have offended others.
My main point was and is that many people seeking help on this list do
not have a real choice as to which version they are using. They are
generally polite when asking questions, and grateful when they get
answers. And it does not really seem necessary to rebuff them using
language like :
"are you using a 3rd-party repackaged piece of junk? ..."
or
"Your version of Tomcat is so ridiculously old ..."
Now if you do not want these people seeking help on this list and at
least getting a civil answer, just say so.
My other point is : we all understand that having a re-packaged version
of Tomcat makes things harder in terms of you trying to help people.
And we appreciate your time and efforts.
But we Tomcat users are also grateful to the system packagers, because
they make life as simple as installing Tomcat with a single command, and
have it magically pop-up running and ready after 2 minutes.
If such packages did not exist, most of us would be hopelessly lost if
during an "official Tomcat" installation, some message popped up about a
missing or incompatible library or prerequisite. And this list would be
swamped.
And if the average Tomcat user or sysadmin were to install the official
Tomcat, they would after that be in front of a nightmare in terms of
overall system maintenance, with files that are, from their point of
view, "all over the place" and in the "wrong" places.
So, maybe the solution consist of preparing a nice and polite
disclaimer, to paste in front of any answer ?
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Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by David Smith <dn...@cornell.edu>.
I hope you feel better having gotten that off your chest. The truth of
the matter is that third party packagers do make breaking changes.
Those using these packages should seek support from the packager first
as many times these third party packages aren't even binary jars from
Apache. They are modified and custom compiled versions of the Apache
tomcat source designed to fit their file system layout and policy.
Regarding the OP, it would be nice to get some detail regarding the
setup (where the webapp was placed, etc., ...) and what if anything is
in the logs. I would guess the web application is stored in the wrong
directory and as such, tomcat can't see it to deploy it.
--David
André Warnier wrote:
>
> Caldarale, Charles R wrote:
>>> From: "J ANDERSEN" <j_...@btinternet.com>
>>> Subject: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
>>>
>>> I am trying to get Tomcat to work (Linux, 64 bits) - it runs
>>> fine, I can connect to localhost:8080, but no matter what I
>>> have tried, there doesn't seem to be any applications.
>>
>> Did you install a real Tomcat from http://tomcat.apache.org, or are
>> you using a 3rd-party repackaged piece of junk? If the latter, throw
>> it away and get the real one. Most, if not all, of the repackaged
>> versions simply don't work and do not conform to the expected
>> installation structure.
>>
> To the original poster : please ignore the comment above.
> Chuck ssems to have something viscerally against any packaged form of
> Tomcat, or any Tomcat that is not the very latest version. He seems
> to be unable to understand and accept that many Tomcat users and
> system admins simply do not have much choice in the matter, and that
> Tomcat does not exist in a void by its own, but is usually part of an
> environment with many constraints other than Tomcat.
> And he wants to ignore the fact that there are tens of thousands of
> Tomcats out there installed from packages, working fine, and easy to run
> and maintain; and dozens of qualified and benevolent software
> packagers, who do their best to provide packages working in a given
> environment.
> It is a real pity, because he undoubtedly knows his Tomcat and Java
> stuff better than most.
> And usually, after this first rash comment, he starts actually trying to
> help.
> There are others on this list that will try to help you if you just
> want help with the Tomcat you got.
>
> André
>
>
>
>
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>
--
David Smith
Network Operations Supervisor
Department of Entomology
Cornell University
2132 Comstock Hall
Ithaca, NY 14853
Phone: (607) 255-9571
Fax: (607) 255-0940
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RE: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by "Caldarale, Charles R" <Ch...@unisys.com>.
> From: André Warnier [mailto:aw@ice-sa.com]
> Subject: Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
>
> Chuck ssems to have something viscerally against any packaged form of
> Tomcat, or any Tomcat that is not the very latest version.
To Andre: don't try to guess my motivations. If you care to examine the archives, you'll find a long list of problems created by attempting to use repackaged versions of Tomcat. If you have problems with one of these mispackaged messes, you need to get support from the person/group that broke it. I have no interest in helping to solve problems that don't exist in a real Tomcat distribution. Try a real Tomcat, and if the problem exists there, let's work on it. If it doesn't exist in a real Tomcat, then take it up with the repackager - or beat your sysadmin over the head with that fact.
As far as latest version, you are again mistaken. Any *supported* level is fine; any 3.3 or 5.0 level does not fall into that category, and 4.x is outside of my experience. Since problems frequently are fixed in newer levels, it behooves anyone asking a question to determine if the situation has been addressed in a current level (admittedly, not always possible).
- Chuck
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Re: [OT] Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by Christopher Schultz <ch...@christopherschultz.net>.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
André,
André Warnier wrote:
| To the original poster : please ignore [Chuck's] comment above.
| Chuck seems to have something viscerally against any packaged form of
| Tomcat, or any Tomcat that is not the very latest version.
Actually, Chuck has an aversion to 3rd-party-packaged versions of Tomcat
because they almost always have configuration files strewn all over the
filesystem, tricks added so that you can just "drop-in" web applications
in some "standard" place, etc.
Most of the questions we field have to do with TC configuration. If our
tips are invalid (because we don't know where the Linux flavor of the
week decides to put its configuration files), then we look like jerks.
It's easier to say "if you want help from us, use our product, not
someone else's".
I wholeheartedly agree.
I also think that TC package managers from those Linux distributors
should lurk this list, and see the configuration problems that all these
folks have due to their hackery, and try to make their packages better.
- -chris
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Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by André Warnier <aw...@ice-sa.com>.
Caldarale, Charles R wrote:
>> From: "J ANDERSEN" <j_...@btinternet.com>
>> Subject: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
>>
>> I am trying to get Tomcat to work (Linux, 64 bits) - it runs
>> fine, I can connect to localhost:8080, but no matter what I
>> have tried, there doesn't seem to be any applications.
>
> Did you install a real Tomcat from http://tomcat.apache.org, or are you using a 3rd-party repackaged piece of junk? If the latter, throw it away and get the real one. Most, if not all, of the repackaged versions simply don't work and do not conform to the expected installation structure.
>
To the original poster : please ignore the comment above.
Chuck ssems to have something viscerally against any packaged form of
Tomcat, or any Tomcat that is not the very latest version. He seems to
be unable to understand and accept that many Tomcat users and system
admins simply do not have much choice in the matter, and that Tomcat
does not exist in a void by its own, but is usually part of an
environment with many constraints other than Tomcat.
And he wants to ignore the fact that there are tens of thousands of
Tomcats out there installed from packages, working fine, and easy to run
and maintain; and dozens of qualified and benevolent software packagers,
who do their best to provide packages working in a given environment.
It is a real pity, because he undoubtedly knows his Tomcat and Java
stuff better than most.
And usually, after this first rash comment, he starts actually trying to
help.
There are others on this list that will try to help you if you just want
help with the Tomcat you got.
André
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RE: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by "Caldarale, Charles R" <Ch...@unisys.com>.
> From: "J ANDERSEN" <j_...@btinternet.com>
> Subject: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
>
> I am trying to get Tomcat to work (Linux, 64 bits) - it runs
> fine, I can connect to localhost:8080, but no matter what I
> have tried, there doesn't seem to be any applications.
Did you install a real Tomcat from http://tomcat.apache.org, or are you using a 3rd-party repackaged piece of junk? If the latter, throw it away and get the real one. Most, if not all, of the repackaged versions simply don't work and do not conform to the expected installation structure.
- Chuck
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Re: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
Posted by Johnny Kewl <jo...@kewlstuff.co.za>.
----- Original Message -----
From: "J ANDERSEN" <j_...@btinternet.com>
To: <us...@tomcat.apache.org>
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2008 3:25 PM
Subject: Tomcat 5.5: Why can't I see the applications?
I am trying to get Tomcat to work (Linux, 64 bits) - it runs fine, I can
connect to localhost:8080, but no matter what I have tried, there doesn't
seem to be any applications. It is probably just a question of find the
right place to set things up, but where?
I have tried to follow the user guide,
http://tomcat.apache.org/tomcat-5.5-doc/index.html, but to no avail, I'm
afraid. Also, what is the default administrator and password supposed to be?
try
localhost:8080/manager/html
admin
no password
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