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Posted to dev@struts.apache.org by "David H. DeWolf" <dd...@apache.org> on 2006/11/30 16:59:49 UTC
[PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
I'd like to bring to the list's attention the proposal [1] and board
resolution [2] for Tiles TLP that have been put together on the Struts
wiki. Please provide any necessary feedback.
In addition to coming to consensus that these look good, I believe that
we need to complete the following prior to voting:
1) Flush out the initial Commiter PMC
- who else is interested?
- who else should we invite?
2) Decide on a PMC Chair
- who is interested?
- who would others like to see?
3) What else? I've never done this, so HELP!?!?
- once voted, how do we bring this to the boards attention?
- should we notify other projects that may be interested?
- . . .?
Please send thoughts on these two topics.
David
[1] http://wiki.apache.org/struts/TilesTopLevel
[2] http://wiki.apache.org/struts/TilesTlpResolution
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by Antonio Petrelli <ap...@apache.org>.
Greg Reddin ha scritto:
> So, ok, I'll do it.
That's the spirit! I always thought you were the right person to sit on
that chair, since Tiles 2 is one of your ideas.
Antonio
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by Greg Reddin <gr...@apache.org>.
On Nov 30, 2006, at 10:23 AM, Wendy Smoak wrote:
> I'd like to see Greg or David as Tiles PMC Chair.
Well I've been thinking about it a lot over the last couple of days.
It's funny how my feelings are almost exactly like David's :-) The
spirit is willing, but the flesh is scared, stressed out, and has
very little time :-)
My biggest concern right now is that my day job project is going into
bi-weekly (every other week) release cycles starting tomorrow
continuing for at least until the end of January and probably
longer. After that we will probably be in monthly release cycles for
most of the year. So.. if it comes up that a board report is due and
my job deadlines are coming up then I think you know which one will
get done first. Is there "grace" from the board wrt to these kinds
of things?
My other biggest concern is that I've only been an apache committer
for about a year and a PMC member for a few months. I'm still pretty
green when it comes to all the foundation stuff. OTOH I have been
following it for about 6 years and have picked up a lot of things by
observation.
So, ok, I'll do it. I'll probably need lots of guidance from some of
you for a while and probably some help getting things done, but I'm
willing to take on the task.
Greg
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by Craig McClanahan <cr...@apache.org>.
On 11/30/06, Wendy Smoak <ws...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On 11/30/06, Antonio Petrelli <ap...@apache.org> wrote:
> > David H. DeWolf ha scritto:
> > > 2) Decide on a PMC Chair
> > > - who is interested?
> >
> > As I can see from this question, then you probably you're not interested
> > :-) Or are you?
>
> I'd like to see Greg or David as Tiles PMC Chair.
+1 on either.
(It doesn't have to be forever... I noticed in the board meeting
> minutes that one project is changing chairs every 1-2 years, which
> might be something to consider.)
>
> Craig or Martin, can you comment on what's actually involved and how
> much time it takes?
Current Board policy is that new TLPs report once a month for the first
three months, then quarterly thereafter. You can see the range of reports
that different TLPs provide in the public board meeting minutes. In
practice, it doesn't take long -- it's not like release notes that need to
track every little detail. The Board primarily wants to hear about the
community aspects, and any issues that the TLP wants to bring to the Board's
attention.
The two things I know of are sending board reports (monthly for a
> while, then quarterly), and requesting accounts and granting karma for
> new committers. Anything else?
As Ted mentions, any PMC member can do the account requests. Karma grants (
i.e. adjusting the SVN permissions) is currently a PMC chair function (it's
editing and checking in a config file, so no big effort involved), but
that's probably negotiable.
Also, as with Ted, I'm also a PMC chair already so it'd be best to have
someone else be the chair here. But, of course, I'll definitely help out as
needed.
--
> Wendy
Craig
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by Wendy Smoak <ws...@gmail.com>.
On 11/30/06, David H. DeWolf <dd...@apache.org> wrote:
> Any interest Wendy?
No, and Greg already said yes. :)
--
Wendy
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by "David H. DeWolf" <dd...@apache.org>.
Ted Husted wrote:
>
> As for someone else, I would just like to point out that Wendy is a
> Member, and she is also conversant with the ins and outs of
> infrastructure. :)
>
Any interest Wendy?
Currently we have nominations (and willingness from those nominated) for:
- David
- Greg
Since it seems like most of the active participants have put in their
2ce, I'll propose a vote on the chair once I hear back from you.
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by Ted Husted <hu...@apache.org>.
On 11/30/06, Wendy Smoak <ws...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I'd like to see Greg or David as Tiles PMC Chair.
>
> (It doesn't have to be forever... I noticed in the board meeting
> minutes that one project is changing chairs every 1-2 years, which
> might be something to consider.)
>
> Craig or Martin, can you comment on what's actually involved and how
> much time it takes?
>
> The two things I know of are sending board reports (monthly for a
> while, then quarterly), and requesting accounts and granting karma for
> new committers. Anything else?
Hmmm, not really. Most administrative tasks, like list moderation, can
be handled by any committer, and don't have to be one person's sole
responsibility.
As for myself, I'm already a PMC chair, and the board doesn't like us
to overextend ourselves.
As for someone else, I would just like to point out that Wendy is a
Member, and she is also conversant with the ins and outs of
infrastructure. :)
-Ted.
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org>.
On 11/30/06, Wendy Smoak <ws...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On 11/30/06, Antonio Petrelli <ap...@apache.org> wrote:
> > David H. DeWolf ha scritto:
> > > 2) Decide on a PMC Chair
> > > - who is interested?
> >
> > As I can see from this question, then you probably you're not interested
> > :-) Or are you?
>
> I'd like to see Greg or David as Tiles PMC Chair.
>
> (It doesn't have to be forever... I noticed in the board meeting
> minutes that one project is changing chairs every 1-2 years, which
> might be something to consider.)
I think a few projects have a fixed-duration policy. I'm not sure how many.
However, it probably works better for larger PMCs, since otherwise it would
really be more of a short rotation (not that there's necessarily anything
wrong with that).
Craig or Martin, can you comment on what's actually involved and how
> much time it takes?
Not much. The board report doesn't have to be an epic, and the ones I've
written have been pretty short. Granting karma is a matter of a minute or
two for each new committer.
The two things I know of are sending board reports (monthly for a
> while, then quarterly), and requesting accounts and granting karma for
> new committers. Anything else?
Nope.
--
Martin Cooper
--
> Wendy
>
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by Wendy Smoak <ws...@gmail.com>.
On 11/30/06, Antonio Petrelli <ap...@apache.org> wrote:
> David H. DeWolf ha scritto:
> > 2) Decide on a PMC Chair
> > - who is interested?
>
> As I can see from this question, then you probably you're not interested
> :-) Or are you?
I'd like to see Greg or David as Tiles PMC Chair.
(It doesn't have to be forever... I noticed in the board meeting
minutes that one project is changing chairs every 1-2 years, which
might be something to consider.)
Craig or Martin, can you comment on what's actually involved and how
much time it takes?
The two things I know of are sending board reports (monthly for a
while, then quarterly), and requesting accounts and granting karma for
new committers. Anything else?
--
Wendy
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org>.
On 11/30/06, David H. DeWolf <dd...@apache.org> wrote:
>
>
>
> Antonio Petrelli wrote:
> > David H. DeWolf ha scritto:
> >> 2) Decide on a PMC Chair
> >> - who is interested?
> >
> > As I can see from this question, then you probably you're not interested
> > :-) Or are you?
>
> I would prefer not. Reasons why:
>
> 1) Not an ASF Member
I think someone else already said this, but being an ASF Member is not
required. Several projects have, or have had, PMC Chairs who are not
members. (In fact, Hen drove much of the scaling down of Jakarta as a
non-Member Chair.)
2) My Apache committer experience is either limited to either small
> projects with little community (Pluto) or a relatively short period of
> time (struts), and because of that, am not convinced I know the ins and
> outs of the foundation. I think I'll learn a lot from being a part of
> the PMC first.
>
> 3) Don't really want to get caught up doing administrative things
> (though I'm willing to help write a board report here and there).
Writing the board report and granting karma are pretty much the only
requirements. That said, while the Chair must submit the board report, he or
she can get help from other PMC members to put it together.
As with Craig and Ted, I'm already a PMC Chair (duh!), so I'm not a
candidate. However, I'd be happy to sit on the PMC and be a mentor of sorts.
--
Martin Cooper
All of that said, if others would like me to or if no one else
> volunteers, I'm willing to do it. I'd just prefer to find someone else
> with a little more "apache grey hair" so to speak.
>
> Greg, are you interested at all?
>
>
> David
>
>
> >
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> >
>
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by "David H. DeWolf" <dd...@apache.org>.
Antonio Petrelli wrote:
> David H. DeWolf ha scritto:
>> 2) Decide on a PMC Chair
>> - who is interested?
>
> As I can see from this question, then you probably you're not interested
> :-) Or are you?
I would prefer not. Reasons why:
1) Not an ASF Member
2) My Apache committer experience is either limited to either small
projects with little community (Pluto) or a relatively short period of
time (struts), and because of that, am not convinced I know the ins and
outs of the foundation. I think I'll learn a lot from being a part of
the PMC first.
3) Don't really want to get caught up doing administrative things
(though I'm willing to help write a board report here and there).
All of that said, if others would like me to or if no one else
volunteers, I'm willing to do it. I'd just prefer to find someone else
with a little more "apache grey hair" so to speak.
Greg, are you interested at all?
David
>
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by Antonio Petrelli <ap...@apache.org>.
David H. DeWolf ha scritto:
> 2) Decide on a PMC Chair
> - who is interested?
As I can see from this question, then you probably you're not interested
:-) Or are you?
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by "David H. DeWolf" <dd...@apache.org>.
Ted Husted wrote:
> I'd suggest announcing the draft proposal to the Shale and MyFaces
> lists, and inviting interested *committers* from those projects to
> sign up on the wiki.
>
Done, thanks!
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by Ted Husted <hu...@apache.org>.
I'd suggest announcing the draft proposal to the Shale and MyFaces
lists, and inviting interested *committers* from those projects to
sign up on the wiki.
It can also be helpful to include everyone's Apache ID, so that they
are ready to add to the Tiles Group, should one be established.
I've applied patches to Tiles in the past, but I don't understand how
the code base actually works, and lately I"ve been gravitating towards
SiteMesh.
-Ted.
On 11/30/06, David H. DeWolf <dd...@apache.org> wrote:
> Ted, should I put you on the committer and pmc lists?
>
> The proposal also lists David Geary, Matthias Wessendorf, and Cedric
> Dumoulin as possible candidates. Should we
>
> - automatically put them on the committer and pmc lists?
> - send individual emails to invite them?
> - leave them off the list unless they express interest?
>
> I'm not sure what the protocol is here.
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Tiles TLP
Posted by "David H. DeWolf" <dd...@apache.org>.
David H. DeWolf wrote:
> 1) Flush out the initial Commiter PMC
> - who else is interested?
> - who else should we invite?
>
Ted, should I put you on the committer and pmc lists?
The proposal also lists David Geary, Matthias Wessendorf, and Cedric
Dumoulin as possible candidates. Should we
- automatically put them on the committer and pmc lists?
- send individual emails to invite them?
- leave them off the list unless they express interest?
I'm not sure what the protocol is here.
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