Question about v1.0 release RC

[Henry Saputra <he...@gmail.com>]

I just saw blog post by gridgain:
  http://gridgain.blogspot.com/2015/02/apache-ignite-v10-is-born.html

which I do not see any VOTE thread about this. Please all committers
and PPMCs be comfortable how ASF does releases [1]

While project is in ASF incubator any publications are ,ore strict
than top level projects [2] so need to make sure to contact ASF press
team about it.
Would love to see announcement in ASF channel first before any vendor website.

- Henry



[1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/releasemanagement.html
[2] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/branding.html

Fwd: Question about v1.0 release RC

[Dmitriy Setrakyan <ds...@apache.org>]

Brane,

We have been very actively working on this Release Candidate as a
community, and I really wanted to put the blog forward. I think everyone
benefits from the increased awareness about Apache Ignite project.

If you look at my blog (
http://gridgain.blogspot.com/2015/02/apache-ignite-v10-is-born.html), I
don't think I violated the Apache policy as I never said that we have
*released* Ignite 1.0. The very first paragraph of my blog states that this
is a *Release Candidate*, which by definition is not an official Apache
release.

Apache release policy actually encourages that Release Candidates are made
public if there is a plan to put it out for a vote, which is exactly what I
did.

Here is a snippet of the release policy documented here:
http://httpd.apache.org/dev/release.html
----
*... Any committer may create a release candidate, provided that it is
based on a releasable (non-vetoed) tag of our current subversion repository
corresponding to the target version number. In order to facilitate
communication, it is deemed nice to alert the community to your planned
release schedule before creating the release candidate, since some other
folks may be on the verge of committing an important change (or backing out
an error). A release candidate should only be made when there is an
intention to propose it for a vote on public release. There are no
"private" releases at Apache.*
----

Thanks,
D.

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 1:13 AM, Branko Čibej <br...@apache.org> wrote:

> On 18.02.2015 18:39, Henry Saputra wrote:
> > I just saw blog post by gridgain:
> >   http://gridgain.blogspot.com/2015/02/apache-ignite-v10-is-born.html
> >
> > which I do not see any VOTE thread about this. Please all committers
> > and PPMCs be comfortable how ASF does releases [1]
> >
> > While project is in ASF incubator any publications are ,ore strict
> > than top level projects [2] so need to make sure to contact ASF press
> > team about it.
> > Would love to see announcement in ASF channel first before any vendor
> website.
>
> There's another, more serious issue: the release hasn't been voted on
> yet, and there's no guarantee that the current candidate artefacts will
> be released. For example, no-one has even run RAT on the artefacts yet,
> as far as I know (I'm working on that and hope to get it done tonight).
>
> You should never, ever blog about a non-existent Apache release as if it
> was a done deal. This is seriously bad behaviour. The blog post even
> calls the release 'available' and provides a download link, even though
> there has not been a single +1 vote from PPMC yet, let alone IPMC. You
> really should think twice before publishing.
>
> I'm going to have to ask you to remove that blog post and issue a
> retraction. Which means, publicly say that you jumped the gun and the
> thing isn't released yet.
>
> -- Brane (not happy at all)
>
>

Re: Question about v1.0 release RC

[Branko Čibej <br...@apache.org>]

On 18.02.2015 18:39, Henry Saputra wrote:
> I just saw blog post by gridgain:
>   http://gridgain.blogspot.com/2015/02/apache-ignite-v10-is-born.html
>
> which I do not see any VOTE thread about this. Please all committers
> and PPMCs be comfortable how ASF does releases [1]
>
> While project is in ASF incubator any publications are ,ore strict
> than top level projects [2] so need to make sure to contact ASF press
> team about it.
> Would love to see announcement in ASF channel first before any vendor website.

There's another, more serious issue: the release hasn't been voted on
yet, and there's no guarantee that the current candidate artefacts will
be released. For example, no-one has even run RAT on the artefacts yet,
as far as I know (I'm working on that and hope to get it done tonight).

You should never, ever blog about a non-existent Apache release as if it
was a done deal. This is seriously bad behaviour. The blog post even
calls the release 'available' and provides a download link, even though
there has not been a single +1 vote from PPMC yet, let alone IPMC. You
really should think twice before publishing.

I'm going to have to ask you to remove that blog post and issue a
retraction. Which means, publicly say that you jumped the gun and the
thing isn't released yet.

-- Brane (not happy at all)

Re: Question about v1.0 release RC

[Dmitriy Setrakyan <ds...@apache.org>]

+1

On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 9:41 AM, Henry Saputra <he...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Ah, my bad. The VOTE thread was sent but got buried with all JIRA
> updates to dev@ list.
>
> Mea culpa from me =(
>
> I will send another DISCUSS email to see if we could and should move
> all JIRA updates to separate mailing list because it looks like
> getting more noise than dev discussions.
>
> - Henry
>
> On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 9:39 AM, Henry Saputra <he...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > I just saw blog post by gridgain:
> >   http://gridgain.blogspot.com/2015/02/apache-ignite-v10-is-born.html
> >
> > which I do not see any VOTE thread about this. Please all committers
> > and PPMCs be comfortable how ASF does releases [1]
> >
> > While project is in ASF incubator any publications are ,ore strict
> > than top level projects [2] so need to make sure to contact ASF press
> > team about it.
> > Would love to see announcement in ASF channel first before any vendor
> website.
> >
> > - Henry
> >
> >
> >
> > [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/releasemanagement.html
> > [2] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/branding.html
>

Re: Question about v1.0 release RC

[Henry Saputra <he...@gmail.com>]

Ah, my bad. The VOTE thread was sent but got buried with all JIRA
updates to dev@ list.

Mea culpa from me =(

I will send another DISCUSS email to see if we could and should move
all JIRA updates to separate mailing list because it looks like
getting more noise than dev discussions.

- Henry

On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 9:39 AM, Henry Saputra <he...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I just saw blog post by gridgain:
>   http://gridgain.blogspot.com/2015/02/apache-ignite-v10-is-born.html
>
> which I do not see any VOTE thread about this. Please all committers
> and PPMCs be comfortable how ASF does releases [1]
>
> While project is in ASF incubator any publications are ,ore strict
> than top level projects [2] so need to make sure to contact ASF press
> team about it.
> Would love to see announcement in ASF channel first before any vendor website.
>
> - Henry
>
>
>
> [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/releasemanagement.html
> [2] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/branding.html

Re: Question about v1.0 release RC

[Dmitriy Setrakyan <ds...@apache.org>]

Henry,

I actually now think you got confused by the word "gridgain" in the URL. I
don't think it is an issue, as the blog is hosted by Blogger.com and is my
personal blog.

D.

On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 10:34 AM, Dmitriy Setrakyan <ds...@apache.org>
wrote:

> In the blog it clearly says that this is a Release Candidate and that the
> project is Incubating.
>
> I did send a VOTE email for the release.
>
> I don't think I need to get ASF approval for blogging about Apache Ignite.
> This is my personal blog and bares no commercial meaning.
>
> D.
>
> On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 9:39 AM, Henry Saputra <he...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I just saw blog post by gridgain:
>>   http://gridgain.blogspot.com/2015/02/apache-ignite-v10-is-born.html
>>
>> which I do not see any VOTE thread about this. Please all committers
>> and PPMCs be comfortable how ASF does releases [1]
>>
>> While project is in ASF incubator any publications are ,ore strict
>> than top level projects [2] so need to make sure to contact ASF press
>> team about it.
>> Would love to see announcement in ASF channel first before any vendor
>> website.
>>
>> - Henry
>>
>>
>>
>> [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/releasemanagement.html
>> [2] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/branding.html
>>
>
>

Re: Question about v1.0 release RC

[Konstantin Boudnik <co...@apache.org>]

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 10:21AM, Branko Čibej wrote:
> On 18.02.2015 19:45, Konstantin Boudnik wrote:
> > Dmitriy,
> >
> > the point isn't about the blogging on the topic but about saying "based on
> > Apache X release Y.Z" unless such thing as Y.Z exists. Now, as the RC is in
> > the vote it isn't an issue, I believe.
> 
> Yes it is. It's a huge issue. That zip file is not a release until it's
> voted so by the IPMC. As of right now, even the PPMC vote isn't closed yet.

Sorry, I was under the impression that having a [VOTE] started is enough to
refer to the RC in question. Thanks Brane - it is great to have you keeping an
eye on things!

Cos

> Nobody should be announcing an Apache release other than through Apache
> channels.
> 
> FWIW, WANdisco got (private) flak for a couple years (from Greg, Hyrum,
> myself, etc.) for doing just this sort of ... I won't repeat the
> adjective ... thing. They've more or less learned now ...
> 
> By the way, that blog post doesn't even follow our trademark policy:
> there's no trademark attribution, and the use of the Ignite logo needs
> permission from the ASF VP of trademarks or from the IPMC chair. It's
> kind of sad to see a project member ignore our own brand protection
> policies.
> 
> -- Brane
> 

Re: Question about v1.0 release RC

[Dmitriy Setrakyan <ds...@apache.org>]

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 1:21 AM, Branko Čibej <br...@apache.org> wrote:

> On 18.02.2015 19:45, Konstantin Boudnik wrote:
> > Dmitriy,
> >
> > the point isn't about the blogging on the topic but about saying "based
> on
> > Apache X release Y.Z" unless such thing as Y.Z exists. Now, as the RC is
> in
> > the vote it isn't an issue, I believe.
>
> Yes it is. It's a huge issue. That zip file is not a release until it's
> voted so by the IPMC. As of right now, even the PPMC vote isn't closed yet.
>

I have been very careful to call it a "release candidate", which is by
definition not an official Apache release. Even the name of the zip has RC1
in it: ignite-fabric-1.0.0-RC1.zip


>
> Nobody should be announcing an Apache release other than through Apache
> channels.
>
> FWIW, WANdisco got (private) flak for a couple years (from Greg, Hyrum,
> myself, etc.) for doing just this sort of ... I won't repeat the
> adjective ... thing. They've more or less learned now ...
>
> By the way, that blog post doesn't even follow our trademark policy:
> there's no trademark attribution, and the use of the Ignite logo needs
> permission from the ASF VP of trademarks or from the IPMC chair. It's
> kind of sad to see a project member ignore our own brand protection
> policies.
>

According to the Apache trademark policy, no permission is needed as long
as the attribution is provided. I have added the attribution to my blog.

The ASF trademark policy is documented here:

http://www.apache.org/foundation/marks/faq/#attribution
http://www.apache.org/foundation/marks/

D.


>
> -- Brane
>
>

Re: Question about v1.0 release RC

[Branko Čibej <br...@apache.org>]

On 18.02.2015 19:45, Konstantin Boudnik wrote:
> Dmitriy,
>
> the point isn't about the blogging on the topic but about saying "based on
> Apache X release Y.Z" unless such thing as Y.Z exists. Now, as the RC is in
> the vote it isn't an issue, I believe.

Yes it is. It's a huge issue. That zip file is not a release until it's
voted so by the IPMC. As of right now, even the PPMC vote isn't closed yet.

Nobody should be announcing an Apache release other than through Apache
channels.

FWIW, WANdisco got (private) flak for a couple years (from Greg, Hyrum,
myself, etc.) for doing just this sort of ... I won't repeat the
adjective ... thing. They've more or less learned now ...

By the way, that blog post doesn't even follow our trademark policy:
there's no trademark attribution, and the use of the Ignite logo needs
permission from the ASF VP of trademarks or from the IPMC chair. It's
kind of sad to see a project member ignore our own brand protection
policies.

-- Brane

Re: Question about v1.0 release RC

[Henry Saputra <he...@gmail.com>]

Yep indeed.

Need to filter my email for the JIRA updates, getting too noisy.

- Henry

On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 10:45 AM, Konstantin Boudnik <co...@apache.org> wrote:
> Dmitriy,
>
> the point isn't about the blogging on the topic but about saying "based on
> Apache X release Y.Z" unless such thing as Y.Z exists. Now, as the RC is in
> the vote it isn't an issue, I believe.
>
> And that's exactly why Henry sent the second email effectively admitting that
> he doesn't read his emails ;) (sorry Henry - couldn't miss the chance to pull
> your leg)
>
> Cos
>
> On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 10:34AM, Dmitriy Setrakyan wrote:
>> In the blog it clearly says that this is a Release Candidate and that the
>> project is Incubating.
>>
>> I did send a VOTE email for the release.
>>
>> I don't think I need to get ASF approval for blogging about Apache Ignite.
>> This is my personal blog and bares no commercial meaning.
>>
>> D.
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 9:39 AM, Henry Saputra <he...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > I just saw blog post by gridgain:
>> >   http://gridgain.blogspot.com/2015/02/apache-ignite-v10-is-born.html
>> >
>> > which I do not see any VOTE thread about this. Please all committers
>> > and PPMCs be comfortable how ASF does releases [1]
>> >
>> > While project is in ASF incubator any publications are ,ore strict
>> > than top level projects [2] so need to make sure to contact ASF press
>> > team about it.
>> > Would love to see announcement in ASF channel first before any vendor
>> > website.
>> >
>> > - Henry
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/releasemanagement.html
>> > [2] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/branding.html
>> >

Re: Question about v1.0 release RC

[Konstantin Boudnik <co...@apache.org>]

Dmitriy,

the point isn't about the blogging on the topic but about saying "based on
Apache X release Y.Z" unless such thing as Y.Z exists. Now, as the RC is in
the vote it isn't an issue, I believe.

And that's exactly why Henry sent the second email effectively admitting that
he doesn't read his emails ;) (sorry Henry - couldn't miss the chance to pull
your leg)

Cos

On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 10:34AM, Dmitriy Setrakyan wrote:
> In the blog it clearly says that this is a Release Candidate and that the
> project is Incubating.
> 
> I did send a VOTE email for the release.
> 
> I don't think I need to get ASF approval for blogging about Apache Ignite.
> This is my personal blog and bares no commercial meaning.
> 
> D.
> 
> On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 9:39 AM, Henry Saputra <he...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
> > I just saw blog post by gridgain:
> >   http://gridgain.blogspot.com/2015/02/apache-ignite-v10-is-born.html
> >
> > which I do not see any VOTE thread about this. Please all committers
> > and PPMCs be comfortable how ASF does releases [1]
> >
> > While project is in ASF incubator any publications are ,ore strict
> > than top level projects [2] so need to make sure to contact ASF press
> > team about it.
> > Would love to see announcement in ASF channel first before any vendor
> > website.
> >
> > - Henry
> >
> >
> >
> > [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/releasemanagement.html
> > [2] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/branding.html
> >

Re: Question about v1.0 release RC

[Dmitriy Setrakyan <ds...@apache.org>]

In the blog it clearly says that this is a Release Candidate and that the
project is Incubating.

I did send a VOTE email for the release.

I don't think I need to get ASF approval for blogging about Apache Ignite.
This is my personal blog and bares no commercial meaning.

D.

On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 9:39 AM, Henry Saputra <he...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> I just saw blog post by gridgain:
>   http://gridgain.blogspot.com/2015/02/apache-ignite-v10-is-born.html
>
> which I do not see any VOTE thread about this. Please all committers
> and PPMCs be comfortable how ASF does releases [1]
>
> While project is in ASF incubator any publications are ,ore strict
> than top level projects [2] so need to make sure to contact ASF press
> team about it.
> Would love to see announcement in ASF channel first before any vendor
> website.
>
> - Henry
>
>
>
> [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/releasemanagement.html
> [2] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/branding.html
>