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[Ws Wiki] Update of "Frontpage/Axis2/f2f 2/Scribe30" by EranChinthaka
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#apache-axis
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Chinthaka Hi all
Chinthaka Dasarath is doing a ppt on data binding
Chinthaka Glen suggested to have our own data binding tool
Chinthaka as well
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Deepal dasarath is doing databinding presentation
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Srinath dasrath is prresenting encoding
Srinath pluggable data binding is the subject
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Srinath we discuss the xmlbeans and ajxb
Srinath jaxb
Srinath have look at the sample of skelteon and stubs'
Srinath decided it is ok to recode gen the stubs and skeltons if the service switches the data binding tool
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Chinthaka meaning, data binding can be set per service basis
Ajith We are in the data binding discussion
Chinthaka Glen : OM has an interface to getObjectValue()
Chinthaka which returns for example java.awt.image
Chinthaka if node contains an image
Chinthaka Ajith : the timetable link in the wiki seems like not working for me :(
{eng}bar4ka hi, what time is it there ?
Chinthaka 9.24 a.m.
{eng}bar4ka wow, here 0.24 am
Deepal hmm
Ajith Chinthak : hold on Will look
{eng}bar4ka Chinthaka, so are you Asian ?
Deepal BTW where r u ?
Chinthaka Srinath suggests to have a databinding layer on top of OM
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Ajith try this
Ajith http://people.apache.org/~ajith/summit/detailed-time-slot.html
Chinthaka ok, thankx
Deepal problem with xml bean and arrays
Srinath dasrath says it might be tricky yo implements encoding interface
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Srinath I thought it is easy .. but let us see
Srinath may be not that easy
Srinath should me have the inbuild databinding thing too
{eng}bar4ka show is apache2 compared to apache1 with respect to performance ?
{eng}bar4ka show = how
Chinthaka bar4ka, this is not a general discussion
Chinthaka we are scribing the stuff going in the on going axis 2 summit
Chinthaka so this may not be the good time to ask questions, sorry abt it :(
Chinthaka evaluating to which extent we need our own data binding tool
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Chinthaka compared to the option of using xml beans
{eng}bar4ka Chinthaka: ok, can i suggest ?
Chinthaka identified following as the problems of using XMLBeans
Deepal bar4ka : sure
Chinthaka 1. if there is some thing wrong, we don;t have control over that
Chinthaka 2. XML beans doesn;t support MTOM
Ajith for the axis 2 perf results
Ajith http://people.apache.org/~ajith/Axis-Perf-Report/PerformanceTestReport.htm
Ajith have a look at this
Chinthaka Dims : Do you want to add some more ?
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{eng}bar4ka I think the new axis 2 role as basic infraestructure provider has little to do with databinding, i guess another sub-project can do this
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{eng}bar4ka and it will be great if it provides easy support for other major databinding tools too
{eng}bar4ka What do you think Chinthaka ?
Chinthaka yeah, I agree
Chinthaka we will definitely provide and now also allowed to have support for other data binding tools
Chinthaka well, as u said its a good idea to have a small sub project to give axis 2 its own data binding tool
Chinthaka so bar4ka why don't you step forward and help us by meeting that challenge :)
{eng}bar4ka what challenge do you refer, make axis 2 own data binding tool ?
Chinthaka yeah
dasarath any existing data-binding tools for axis c++
{eng}bar4ka i will need to much time to introduce myself better into axis 2
{eng}bar4ka to = too
Chinthaka summing up data binding discussion
Chinthaka 1. support MTOM / XOP
Chinthaka 2. pluggable data binding support
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chathura candidate:
chathura xml beans
chathura jaxb
chathura castor
chathura and our very own:)
Chinthaka 3. SwA support
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Chinthaka 4. wdsl2java and java2wsdl support for all
chathura ok MTOM presentation comming up
Ajith after tea :D
Chinthaka Ajith : +1
chathura current discussion....
chathura Sanjiva: there are 150 languages that compiles to JVM
chathura "Axis 2 should be engineered(if possible) so that it will be the SOAP stack for all those languges
dasarath axis 2 will comprise of java handlers and non-java service implementation
Lilantha make handlers in java
Lilantha and call services written in nay languages
Lilantha EIS?
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Lilantha can we levarage connector architecture
Lilantha or JNI
Lilantha or JMS??
dasarath provider is responsible for calling the service implementation which may be implemented in any language but how it does that is immaterial
dasarath if it is C/C++ then it is JNI
Lilantha yep
Chinthaka JNI is calling other C ++ impls
Chinthaka for example
chathura well thats no the exact isssue
Lilantha may be using connector architecture?
Chinthaka I wrote a provider which works with a jscript service
Chinthaka so basicallt the service is jscript
chathura issue is if we are providing support for other languages we should.t rethink our databinding stuff and make it extensible for other languaes(other than java)
Lilantha seralize in a language neutral way
chathura yah but deserialisation isnt
Chinthaka TEA BREAK !!!!
chathura "MTOM after tea":)
Lilantha use CORBA concepts?
{eng}bar4ka while we drink tea, where are guys from ?
{eng}bar4ka i mean where are you from ?
chathura BAck to MTOM presentation
sanjiva_ sri lanka :-)
dasarath where is thilina
dasarath ?
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Deepal Chinthka is doing Axiom presenation
Deepal binary to inforset discussion
Deepal DFDL
Deepal currenty we have three kind of builders
Deepal StAXOMBuilder
Deepal StAXSOAPBuilder
Deepal StAXMTOMBuilder
Deepal glen : what dose StAXSOAPBuilde do
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Lilantha do u have the URL to ppt?
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Srinath Chinthaka is presenting OM
Srinath he had falshy slides
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Deepal we will give the link
Srinath http://people.apache.org/~ajith/summit/
Srinath the link
Deepal http://people.apache.org/~ajith/summit/
Deepal AXIOM presentation is under that
Srinath chinthaka is explaing the OM interfaces ..
Srinath he explaisn the builders
Srinath we talked about the fast WS and OM a bit
Srinath if we can write a pull parser out of binary stream we are same
Srinath if we do a new builder .. it might be bit tricky
Srinath but not impossible
Deepal rename SOAPHeader to SOAPHeader bolck
Deepal in OM
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Deepal hi jaya Venket is here
Deepal LLOM is better preforming
Deepal than table model
Deepal LLOM -linked list model
Deepal now talking Desgn poins slide
chathura glen: why do you wannna cache when you serialize
Jaya hey venkat
Srinath am in the middle of glen and dasrath arguing about OMElement.serialize(writer,cache);
Deepal do u want to talk to nvenkat
Deepal jaya : do u want to talk to nvenkat
Srinath trying to not cought in the middle ;)
Srinath it is getting intersting :D
sanjiva_ pointer to Eran's presentation: http://people.apache.org/~ajith/summit/ (look for the axiom preesntation)
Srinath we are getting to some where :)
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Jaya Deepal: check the personal chat window. I've sent you a message
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chathura decession: We need a method in om Elelment.complete();
Deepal there going an interesting discussion
Deepal with cache on/off
Deepal big arguments :)
ashutosh what does omElement.complete() do?
Srinath it complete the element
Srinath mans completly build the element
Srinath means
Deepal if it is the root prase whole message and
Deepal builde SOAPEnevelop out of that
ashutosh presently is it done through detach method??
Deepal soory build
ashutosh that is if we do detach, it gets built completely if it wasn't
Deepal hmm yup
chathura yup remember the issue we had in the sample few days back
ashutosh yeah ... thats what i was thinking abt
Jaya was something done in addChildElement() of OMElement so that if a non-empty text node already is present extra non-text child nodes don't get added???
Jaya i.e. something like <billamount ...> 120 <taxPercentage> 8 </taxPercentage> </billamount> is not allowed
chathura another decession: In OM we should build upto the header as the handlers access the envelop ... but leave alone the body part untouched
Jaya ok! not an issue if om is only worried about XML
chathura Rational: to see whether we have must understand in the headers
ashutosh chathura: but then what happens when security comes into picture?
chathura nothing happens
Deepal remove cache argumnet from element.serlize(straemWriter , cache)
chathura if the security handler wants to access the body let him go ahead and access
ashutosh okk
ashutosh anything decided on data binding integration with AXIOM?
Jaya You mean even if cache is off, we are going to build till headers for sure!?!
Deepal yup:
Deepal we have to do that
Deepal else how can we find mustunderstand and all
chathura hang on
Jaya okay
chathura deepal:cool
GlenD There are two flags for caching - one on serialize() and one on getPullParser().
GlenD Either we should leave them both there, and provide a convenience method serialize(XmlStreamWriter) which defaults cache to false...
GlenD Or we remove the arguments from both and make it a builder-wide flag (builder.setCache(boolean))
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dmwaters {global notice} Hi all! In about 1.5 hours, I'm going to be rebooting the main US hub for a kernel update. This willbe the last of the fixes for the boxes that had the buggy kernel code. This reboot will also take down www.freenode.net briefly. Maintainence should only take about 10 minutes at the most. I apologize for the late notice.
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Lilantha bye all, good night...
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Deepal discsussing about MC serlilization
Deepal which is relly requird for RM
Srinath we explaisn MTOM now
Ajith Guys the summit material page is updated now
Ajith the MTOM presentation is also there
Srinath when the Transport Reciver recived a message from the transport we know that it is MTOM
Ajith http://people.apache.org/~ajith/summit/
Srinath do we have a MTOM builder to build the OM
Srinath glen said we need to seperate XOP and MTOM
Srinath have a two level arch
Srinath archi
Srinath the XOP things is pluggable
Srinath MTOM is XOP conntected to SOAP
Srinath agreed
Srinath comment accepted
Srinath OMblob tries differd building
Srinath we are in big discussion of making OM schema aware ...oops
Srinath ;)
Ajith he he Here we are coming back to my "builder extensions"
Ajith :D
Chinthaka well I won again
Chinthaka :D
Srinath thanks god :)
Deepal no schema aware parsing
Deepal in MTOM base64 content represent as OMText
Srinath the OMtext has getText() and get data handler
Deepal the person who is going to use the axiom has to aware of that
Srinath ye
Deepal buffering is done in MTOM
Deepal serilization
Deepal so discsscusing drawback of that
Srinath give a Blob a CID
Srinath OM blobs knows how they will be written later
Deepal so no buffring
Deepal OMblob has to to its own serialization
Deepal has to do
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Deepal talking little bit abt clinet side
Deepal client seide sender , how can we specify wt to use
Deepal in the client sid eand how client.xml look like
Deepal sid eand = side and
Srinath api has the presenance, then conf file, then classapth tricks ect
Deepal is HTTP Mime and SMTP mime are same
Deepal mean format
Deepal header formt and bondry
Deepal boundery
GlenD boundary
chathura :)
Deepal wrting OM aware java mail like implementation
Deepal ?
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Deepal chinthka : do u have whole today chat log
Chinthaka yeah
Chinthaka but I'm not happy with the way my tool has formatted the chat log
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Chinthaka People are still having lunch here
Srinath people are donw with eating and back
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Deepal talking about axis module
Deepal mean maven module
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Chinthaka decided to base axis 2 on jdk 1.4
sanjiva Minimum Java config: JDK 1.4
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Chinthaka runtime will be on java 1.4
Chinthaka but for offline building java 1.5 is allowed
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Chinthaka package structure has bit of changes
Chinthaka the src will be removed
Chinthaka module/core/org
Chinthaka module/core/test
Chinthaka module/core/test-resources likewise
Chinthaka the ws-fx handlers will be in their own places
Chinthaka not under axis 2
Chinthaka so the followings will be handlers
Chinthaka sorry modules
Chinthaka 1. core
Chinthaka 2. OM
Chinthaka 3. samples
Chinthaka 4. WOM
Chinthaka 5. server
Chinthaka well we reordered
Chinthaka 1. OM
Chinthaka WOM
Chinthaka 2. WOM
Chinthaka 3. Core
ashutosh do we have module/core/org/apache/axis directly? shudn't a java in between, like module/core/java/org/apache be better
Chinthaka Ashu : No
Chinthaka coz we have two java
Chinthaka axis/trunk/*java*/module/core/*java*
Chinthaka see
Chinthaka here people are re-arranging the structure
ashutosh ok but then we shud have src instead of java, as now u'll have different structure for test and src directory
guillaume_s but we have *test* at the same level : axis/trunk/*java*/module/core/*test*/org/...
Chinthaka sorry
Jaya for setting up source path in eclipse it might be little annoying if you don't have a top level folder for all the source
guillaume_s src/src ?
ashutosh exactly
Chinthaka I've mentioned wrong
Chinthaka its like module/core/src
Chinthaka module/core/test
Chinthaka sorry :(
ashutosh ok, this looks fine :)
guillaume_s this is not a *usual* maven structure ...
Jaya perfectly fine
Chinthaka Guilaume : Why ???
Chinthaka are we gonna shape our project according to Maven
Chinthaka its just a build tool
Chinthaka :(
guillaume_s almost all maven projects have a src folder with all sources inside (java sources, test sources, resources, ...)
Chinthaka ohhhhhh
guillaume_s that can be confusing for developpers who are used to buil with maven
Chinthaka we just removed OM name from the package structure :( :( :(
Chinthaka its renamed to xml
Jaya but seperating test sources and code sources can help to set up IDEs with just the required contents
Chinthaka as it *will* contain some data binding stuff as well
ashutosh chinthaka, that looks good infact, why :( ??
Jaya OM renamed? me too :(
Chinthaka OM is a good name :(
Chinthaka Jaya, u with me ??
Jaya yup, we both with OM. But not to start a fight against the big wigs decision, though
Ajith0213 :)
Chinthaka poor we :(
ashutosh anyways, what has been decided on data binding?
Chinthaka well but it has a meaning though
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Chinthaka we gonna have our own data binding as well
ashutosh no castor??
Chinthaka but we can plugin any data binding tool
ashutosh ok
Chinthaka Ashu : anything
Jaya Chintaka actually OM name in the initial when I tried to understand it was very confusing, being frank. If one were to write documentation the same would clrearly reflect.
Chinthaka JAXB, Castor, JAXMe, XMLBEans, u name it, we have it
chathurah__ :)
Chinthaka well, is the current documentation not enough ?
dasarath :)
Chinthaka http://ws.apache.org/axis2/OMTutorial.html
Jaya The whole architecture we call OM at several places, the object model that is built inside is also called OM
Chinthaka the whole archi is AXIOM
Chinthaka and what is build inside is OM
dasarath isn't the "trade-mark" of OM is AXIOM
dasarath I would like to see an axiom module in the axis build
Jaya But OM is understood as a short for AXIOM, hence the confusion
dasarath OM=object model
dasarath period
dasarath I guess our classnames create this confusion
Jaya yeah yeah. now that after getting deep there doesn't seem any confusion. But when I started I had a lot confusion
Chinthaka thats how really good thing are
Chinthaka outside it seems really great
Chinthaka but inside .... :)
Chinthaka well this is the re-re-refined module structure
dasarath :) and OM is not any different
Jaya :)
dasarath but hopefully we will do some cleaning very soon
Chinthaka 1. XML (OM + Data Binding impl + Data binding interfaces)
Chinthaka 2. WOM
Chinthaka 3. Core
dasarath -1 for xml
Chinthaka 4. Server (Providers, Listeners)
Chinthaka 5. Samples
Chinthaka 6. Tool
dasarath xml is just one form of serialization
Chinthaka 6. Tools
Chinthaka 7. JCP
Jaya what happened to the transport stuff???
dasarath OM itself goes beyond the xml inforset
Jaya I think I'll have refactor my commonsHTTP effort once again then
Chinthaka they goes under core
Chinthaka Jaya, refactoring is nothing and usual thing :)
Ajith Jay - Only thing is the class locations change. not the packages
Jaya Yeah, trying to convince me of that fact
ashutosh what abt SOAP specific classes of OM? r they under xml too?
Chinthaka yeah
Chinthaka discussing that now
Ajith so probably you wont need to do naything except put the correct dependancies
ashutosh chinthaka, u wanted them to move outside?
Jaya Ajith: got it. earlier also I didn't do anything great
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Chinthaka Ashu : What do u mean ?
ashutosh u wanted om to take care of just xml infoset?
Chinthaka yeah, now too
Chinthaka and ppl have agreed for that
Chinthaka but its nice to have SOAP specific thing also ;)
Chinthaka so, bit of compramisation
Deepal new module structure
Deepal http://people.apache.org/~deepal/axis2f2f/moduels.JPG
Chinthaka deepal, u r too smart
Chinthaka :)
Deepal :)
ashutosh looks good :)
Chinthaka but u have missed jcp
Chinthaka :)
Ajith Deepal: you missed JCP
Deepal i will update that
Chinthaka transport stuff
Chinthaka all the senders goto core
Chinthaka all the listeners goto server
ashutosh what will JCP have?? :-S
Chinthaka SAAJ stuff u guys gonna do ;)
Deepal i updated the image sorry for mistake
ashutosh deepal u would also like to correct the filename to modules.JPG
Chinthaka are we giving him hard time ;)
ashutosh :)
Deepal oh ok
guillaume_s jcp should contains saaj (1.2 and next version ?), jaxrpc(1.1 and 2.0) APIs + axis impl
Deepal done
Deepal http://people.apache.org/~deepal/axis2f2f/modules.JPG
Chinthaka people now talk about the module interface
Deepal glen : engine is not stateless
Deepal srinath : it is not
Chinthaka Now we have a problem
Chinthaka whether Axis engine is stateless or not
Deepal what is Axisengine , wt it has
Chinthaka we have world war 4 here ;)
dasarath glen: "A Service has an associated cloud of state"
Deepal are we going to have mulitple axisengine
dasarath fox: Its actually a storm of state
Deepal per one transport
Chinthaka ;)
Deepal (dims asking)
dasarath :D
Chinthaka Deepal : Are u a commentator of a cricket match ??
chathurah__ :)
ashutosh c'mon hez doin a better job than Ranjit Fernando ;)
Chinthaka well anyone can do better than him man ;)
Chinthaka now people are drawing some pictures and ruchith is taking some pictures
dasarath both sanjiva and glen are drawing pictures
chathurah__ :)
dasarath people are talking about persistance in axis
dasarath what are the contexts that we should have?
dasarath ws-context, message-context, transport-context, ...
Chinthaka sanjiva proposed another architecture
Chinthaka a slightly different one
dasarath should we or should we not have session scope in axis 2.0
Deepal big discussion about scope
Deepal Engine conttext
Deepal Service conttext
Deepal module conttext
Deepal transport conttext
Deepal and message context
Chinthaka one can see the Sanjiva's proposal here
Chinthaka http://people.apache.org/~chinthaka/summit/IMG_0638.jpg
Chinthaka sorry changed the name of the file
Chinthaka http://people.apache.org/~chinthaka/summit/sanjiva_prop.jpg
Deepal http://people.apache.org/~deepal/axis2f2f/newarchi.JPG
Deepal new architecture purosed by Sanjiva
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GlenD -- It is possible for various components (services, etc) to access the various scopes... have to be careful about this. For instance, the AdminService is a service which affects the Registry. We need to continue to support this sort of thing.
GlenD -- A "two level" registry seems like a good idea by default. There is the "persistent" registry, which is the one that corresponds to the disk/database version of the configuration. If you write to that one via APIs, you end up writing to persistent storage. Then there's the "dynamic" registry which sits on top.
GlenD ...the dynamic one lets you do things like deploy asynchronous callback endpoints (which come and go) without messing up the on-disk version of your config.
GlenD -- We need to continue to support Axis 1's concept of scope chaining, where it should be possible to ask for things from the MessageContext which are supplied by whatever context level at which they are first encountered (i.e. setting SEND_XSI_TYPES at the engine level makes that setting available to all services which haven't overridden that themselves)
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dims http://yfilter.cs.berkeley.edu/
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Chinthaka hey guys look at this
Chinthaka https://stax2dom.dev.java.net/
Chinthaka seems they have done some of our work
Deepal hi ashu, and jaya - venkat here. Do you guys have any questions for the topics so far discussed here?
ashutosh hi venkat, we'll keep on shooting as and when we have questions
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Deepal dicussing about module
Deepal init() method
Deepal what we give as argument
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