Recommendation...

["Maldonado, Daniel CW2 NGCT" <da...@us.army.mil>]

After playing with C# and .NET for a while our group has decided that we need
some Java web apps to make our applicatons "enterprise" friendly and to get
buy-in from our peers who refuse to use .NET.

I was thinking about using Tapestry and Hibernate to help me with some of our
issues.
However, I have heard that Spring is a great framework as well.

I know that I have a lot of reading to do but if someone on this list could
give me their perspective (from experience) about which one to use I would
really appreciate the help and possibly save me a LOT of time.

Are there any benefits to using Tapestry and Spring together?

Would it be easier to just stick with Tapestry and Hibernate?

Thank you for your help.

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Re: Recommendation...

[Steve Wells <we...@gmail.com>]

Just to add to the flood of options...

A while ago a put together an application with tutorial/notes style docs
that lightly covers Tapestry 4, HiveMind, Cayenne (similar to Hibernate),
Maven build tool and Tomcat.  It shows how to configure and get started with
these frameworks.

http://sourceforge.net/projects/tapcaycrud

The docs are probably more useful than the app:
http://tapcaycrud.sourceforge.net/

It might help.

Steve

On 12/01/07, Koka Kiknadze <22...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Would it be easier to just stick with Tapestry and Hibernate?
>
> If you are worried about having to dive into several new frameworks
> simultaneously imho Tapestry+iBatis would be great starter. Though iBatis
> is
> not an ORM like hibernate, but it'll take you one day to start using it to
> get read of all that tedious JDBC code. After you could throw
> Spring/Hibernate/... in.
>
>

Re: Recommendation...

[Koka Kiknadze <22...@gmail.com>]

> Would it be easier to just stick with Tapestry and Hibernate?

If you are worried about having to dive into several new frameworks
simultaneously imho Tapestry+iBatis would be great starter. Though iBatis is
not an ORM like hibernate, but it'll take you one day to start using it to
get read of all that tedious JDBC code. After you could throw
Spring/Hibernate/... in.

RE: Recommendation...

["Maldonado, Daniel CW2 NGCT" <da...@us.army.mil>]

Thank you all.  
It seems that Tapestry, Spring and Hibernate is the best option for us.

I appreciate all the help.

Dan.

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Re: Recommendation...

["B.S.Navin" <bs...@effigent.net>]

A Tapestry-Spring-Hibernate stack is good - although it may take some  
time to get it right (depending on the complexity of your app).

We use this stack in our project and one of the prime factors for  
including Spring here is its convenient transaction-management  
support. It gets much better with the use of the new annotation-based  
transaction management.

Spring 2.0 seems to have a lot more to offer (including many of the  
attractive hivemind features listed previously here) - but I have not  
tried those out.

- Navin

On 13-Jan-07, at 2:00 AM, Dan Adams wrote:

> Yes. I have had this too, especially on projects that have a full test
> suite. It's great. :)
>
> On Fri, 2007-01-12 at 19:33 +0200, Marilen Corciovei wrote:
>> What I think is also very important is not only that you develop fast
>> but that you can maintain your code even years after the initial
>> development. As I recently found myself with a 1.5 years old tapestry
>> code it was still extremely clear to me where to find and modify
>> everything.
>>
>> Len
>> www.len.ro
>>
>> On Fri, 2007-01-12 at 12:15 -0500, Dan Adams wrote:
>>
>>> Tapestry, Hibernate, and Spring is a great combination. We use them
>>> extensively here in a number of applications and have had a great  
>>> deal
>>> of success with them. They complement each other very well. Although
>>> Tapestry uses hivemind you can still easily use Spring to manage  
>>> your
>>> application state as we do. We also make heavy use of annotations  
>>> which
>>> makes development much easier than using the xml configurations.  
>>> Here's
>>> some recommended reading based on the books I have read:
>>>
>>> Java Persistence with Hibernate
>>> Enjoying Web Development with Tapestry
>>> Tapestry in Action (older but gives a better overview of Tapestry  
>>> and
>>> it's purpose)
>>> Pro Spring
>>>
>>> I would also *strongly* recommend that you investigate using  
>>> HtmlUnit to
>>> test your application. Our development environment runs in Jetty and
>>> HSQLDB and we have had a lot of success with using TDD with  
>>> HtmlUnit to
>>> get 99-100% test coverage.
>>>
>>> Once you get set up I hope your experience is close to mine; it's a
>>> great development environment and you'll be amazed at how fast  
>>> you can
>>> develop applications.
>>>
>>> On Fri, 2007-01-12 at 11:09 -0500, Maldonado, Daniel CW2 NGCT wrote:
>>>> After playing with C# and .NET for a while our group has decided  
>>>> that we need
>>>> some Java web apps to make our applicatons "enterprise" friendly  
>>>> and to get
>>>> buy-in from our peers who refuse to use .NET.
>>>>
>>>> I was thinking about using Tapestry and Hibernate to help me  
>>>> with some of our
>>>> issues.
>>>> However, I have heard that Spring is a great framework as well.
>>>>
>>>> I know that I have a lot of reading to do but if someone on this  
>>>> list could
>>>> give me their perspective (from experience) about which one to  
>>>> use I would
>>>> really appreciate the help and possibly save me a LOT of time.
>>>>
>>>> Are there any benefits to using Tapestry and Spring together?
>>>>
>>>> Would it be easier to just stick with Tapestry and Hibernate?
>>>>
>>>> Thank you for your help.
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>>> --
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>>>>
> -- 
> Dan Adams
> Senior Software Engineer
> Interactive Factory
> 617.235.5857
>
>
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>


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Re: Recommendation...

[Dan Adams <da...@ifactory.com>]

Yes. I have had this too, especially on projects that have a full test
suite. It's great. :)

On Fri, 2007-01-12 at 19:33 +0200, Marilen Corciovei wrote:
> What I think is also very important is not only that you develop fast
> but that you can maintain your code even years after the initial
> development. As I recently found myself with a 1.5 years old tapestry
> code it was still extremely clear to me where to find and modify
> everything.
> 
> Len
> www.len.ro
> 
> On Fri, 2007-01-12 at 12:15 -0500, Dan Adams wrote:
> 
> > Tapestry, Hibernate, and Spring is a great combination. We use them
> > extensively here in a number of applications and have had a great deal
> > of success with them. They complement each other very well. Although
> > Tapestry uses hivemind you can still easily use Spring to manage your
> > application state as we do. We also make heavy use of annotations which
> > makes development much easier than using the xml configurations. Here's
> > some recommended reading based on the books I have read:
> > 
> > Java Persistence with Hibernate
> > Enjoying Web Development with Tapestry
> > Tapestry in Action (older but gives a better overview of Tapestry and
> > it's purpose)
> > Pro Spring
> > 
> > I would also *strongly* recommend that you investigate using HtmlUnit to
> > test your application. Our development environment runs in Jetty and
> > HSQLDB and we have had a lot of success with using TDD with HtmlUnit to
> > get 99-100% test coverage.
> > 
> > Once you get set up I hope your experience is close to mine; it's a
> > great development environment and you'll be amazed at how fast you can
> > develop applications.
> > 
> > On Fri, 2007-01-12 at 11:09 -0500, Maldonado, Daniel CW2 NGCT wrote:
> > > After playing with C# and .NET for a while our group has decided that we need
> > > some Java web apps to make our applicatons "enterprise" friendly and to get
> > > buy-in from our peers who refuse to use .NET.
> > > 
> > > I was thinking about using Tapestry and Hibernate to help me with some of our
> > > issues.
> > > However, I have heard that Spring is a great framework as well.
> > > 
> > > I know that I have a lot of reading to do but if someone on this list could
> > > give me their perspective (from experience) about which one to use I would
> > > really appreciate the help and possibly save me a LOT of time.
> > > 
> > > Are there any benefits to using Tapestry and Spring together?
> > > 
> > > Would it be easier to just stick with Tapestry and Hibernate?
> > > 
> > > Thank you for your help.
> > > 
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > 
-- 
Dan Adams
Senior Software Engineer
Interactive Factory
617.235.5857


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Re: Recommendation...

[Marilen Corciovei <le...@nemesisit.rdsnet.ro>]

What I think is also very important is not only that you develop fast
but that you can maintain your code even years after the initial
development. As I recently found myself with a 1.5 years old tapestry
code it was still extremely clear to me where to find and modify
everything.

Len
www.len.ro

On Fri, 2007-01-12 at 12:15 -0500, Dan Adams wrote:

> Tapestry, Hibernate, and Spring is a great combination. We use them
> extensively here in a number of applications and have had a great deal
> of success with them. They complement each other very well. Although
> Tapestry uses hivemind you can still easily use Spring to manage your
> application state as we do. We also make heavy use of annotations which
> makes development much easier than using the xml configurations. Here's
> some recommended reading based on the books I have read:
> 
> Java Persistence with Hibernate
> Enjoying Web Development with Tapestry
> Tapestry in Action (older but gives a better overview of Tapestry and
> it's purpose)
> Pro Spring
> 
> I would also *strongly* recommend that you investigate using HtmlUnit to
> test your application. Our development environment runs in Jetty and
> HSQLDB and we have had a lot of success with using TDD with HtmlUnit to
> get 99-100% test coverage.
> 
> Once you get set up I hope your experience is close to mine; it's a
> great development environment and you'll be amazed at how fast you can
> develop applications.
> 
> On Fri, 2007-01-12 at 11:09 -0500, Maldonado, Daniel CW2 NGCT wrote:
> > After playing with C# and .NET for a while our group has decided that we need
> > some Java web apps to make our applicatons "enterprise" friendly and to get
> > buy-in from our peers who refuse to use .NET.
> > 
> > I was thinking about using Tapestry and Hibernate to help me with some of our
> > issues.
> > However, I have heard that Spring is a great framework as well.
> > 
> > I know that I have a lot of reading to do but if someone on this list could
> > give me their perspective (from experience) about which one to use I would
> > really appreciate the help and possibly save me a LOT of time.
> > 
> > Are there any benefits to using Tapestry and Spring together?
> > 
> > Would it be easier to just stick with Tapestry and Hibernate?
> > 
> > Thank you for your help.
> > 
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > 

Re: Recommendation...

[Dan Adams <da...@ifactory.com>]

Tapestry, Hibernate, and Spring is a great combination. We use them
extensively here in a number of applications and have had a great deal
of success with them. They complement each other very well. Although
Tapestry uses hivemind you can still easily use Spring to manage your
application state as we do. We also make heavy use of annotations which
makes development much easier than using the xml configurations. Here's
some recommended reading based on the books I have read:

Java Persistence with Hibernate
Enjoying Web Development with Tapestry
Tapestry in Action (older but gives a better overview of Tapestry and
it's purpose)
Pro Spring

I would also *strongly* recommend that you investigate using HtmlUnit to
test your application. Our development environment runs in Jetty and
HSQLDB and we have had a lot of success with using TDD with HtmlUnit to
get 99-100% test coverage.

Once you get set up I hope your experience is close to mine; it's a
great development environment and you'll be amazed at how fast you can
develop applications.

On Fri, 2007-01-12 at 11:09 -0500, Maldonado, Daniel CW2 NGCT wrote:
> After playing with C# and .NET for a while our group has decided that we need
> some Java web apps to make our applicatons "enterprise" friendly and to get
> buy-in from our peers who refuse to use .NET.
> 
> I was thinking about using Tapestry and Hibernate to help me with some of our
> issues.
> However, I have heard that Spring is a great framework as well.
> 
> I know that I have a lot of reading to do but if someone on this list could
> give me their perspective (from experience) about which one to use I would
> really appreciate the help and possibly save me a LOT of time.
> 
> Are there any benefits to using Tapestry and Spring together?
> 
> Would it be easier to just stick with Tapestry and Hibernate?
> 
> Thank you for your help.
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> 
-- 
Dan Adams
Senior Software Engineer
Interactive Factory
617.235.5857


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Re: Recommendation...

[James Carman <ja...@carmanconsulting.com>]

The tapestry-acegi allows you to use Acegi's @Secured annotation
(declarative security) in Tapestry without the Spring container.


On 1/12/07, Daniel Tabuenca <dt...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I am very happy using Tapestry for the WEB portion of my application
> and Spring 2.0 to wire up and configure my beans and do all the other
> stuff spring does. I especially like using spring with the Spring
> Annotations addon. There is some overlap between Tapestry and Spring
> in that tapestry uses it's own IOC container called Hivemind. While
> hivemind and spring share many features in the wire-your-beans up
> department spring's has many additional features unrelated to bean
> wiring (such as Acegi Security for example). The only thing spring
> doesn't seem to have is hiveminds hierarchical configuration where you
> can define configuration points that get configured differently
> depending on which jar you drop in. This is kind of neat and I wish
> spring did that.
>
>
> On 1/12/07, Maldonado, Daniel CW2 NGCT <da...@us.army.mil> wrote:
> > After playing with C# and .NET for a while our group has decided that we need
> > some Java web apps to make our applicatons "enterprise" friendly and to get
> > buy-in from our peers who refuse to use .NET.
> >
> > I was thinking about using Tapestry and Hibernate to help me with some of our
> > issues.
> > However, I have heard that Spring is a great framework as well.
> >
> > I know that I have a lot of reading to do but if someone on this list could
> > give me their perspective (from experience) about which one to use I would
> > really appreciate the help and possibly save me a LOT of time.
> >
> > Are there any benefits to using Tapestry and Spring together?
> >
> > Would it be easier to just stick with Tapestry and Hibernate?
> >
> > Thank you for your help.
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
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>
>

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Re: Recommendation...

[Cyrille37 <cy...@gmail.com>]

Daniel Tabuenca a écrit :
> While
> hivemind and spring share many features in the wire-your-beans up
> department spring's has many additional features unrelated to bean
> wiring (such as Acegi Security for example). 
If I can add that with Spring, you can manage operation transaction 
within configuration file (.xml) vs. hard coded in business code 
(.java). I think it is a very important subject.

Cyrille
ps: sorry for my poor english.


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Re: Recommendation...

[Daniel Tabuenca <dt...@gmail.com>]

I am very happy using Tapestry for the WEB portion of my application
and Spring 2.0 to wire up and configure my beans and do all the other
stuff spring does. I especially like using spring with the Spring
Annotations addon. There is some overlap between Tapestry and Spring
in that tapestry uses it's own IOC container called Hivemind. While
hivemind and spring share many features in the wire-your-beans up
department spring's has many additional features unrelated to bean
wiring (such as Acegi Security for example). The only thing spring
doesn't seem to have is hiveminds hierarchical configuration where you
can define configuration points that get configured differently
depending on which jar you drop in. This is kind of neat and I wish
spring did that.


On 1/12/07, Maldonado, Daniel CW2 NGCT <da...@us.army.mil> wrote:
> After playing with C# and .NET for a while our group has decided that we need
> some Java web apps to make our applicatons "enterprise" friendly and to get
> buy-in from our peers who refuse to use .NET.
>
> I was thinking about using Tapestry and Hibernate to help me with some of our
> issues.
> However, I have heard that Spring is a great framework as well.
>
> I know that I have a lot of reading to do but if someone on this list could
> give me their perspective (from experience) about which one to use I would
> really appreciate the help and possibly save me a LOT of time.
>
> Are there any benefits to using Tapestry and Spring together?
>
> Would it be easier to just stick with Tapestry and Hibernate?
>
> Thank you for your help.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>

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Re: Recommendation...

[Daniel Honig <da...@gmail.com>]

Also check out the .NET version of Maverick.



On 1/12/07, Maldonado, Daniel CW2 NGCT <da...@us.army.mil> wrote:
> After playing with C# and .NET for a while our group has decided that we need
> some Java web apps to make our applicatons "enterprise" friendly and to get
> buy-in from our peers who refuse to use .NET.
>
> I was thinking about using Tapestry and Hibernate to help me with some of our
> issues.
> However, I have heard that Spring is a great framework as well.
>
> I know that I have a lot of reading to do but if someone on this list could
> give me their perspective (from experience) about which one to use I would
> really appreciate the help and possibly save me a LOT of time.
>
> Are there any benefits to using Tapestry and Spring together?
>
> Would it be easier to just stick with Tapestry and Hibernate?
>
> Thank you for your help.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>

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