Current board agenda might be broken

["John D. Ament" <jo...@apache.org>]

Not sure what could have caused it.

- MADlib looks correct
- Atlas isn't processing as an establish (not sure why)
- Mynewt only picks up Justin's name, no one else's

John

Re: Current board agenda might be broken

[Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net>]

On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 9:57 AM, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 9:13 AM Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 9:06 AM, John D. Ament <jo...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 7:52 AM Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 7:12 AM, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
>> >> wrote:
>> >> > Not sure what could have caused it.
>> >> >
>> >> > - MADlib looks correct
>> >>
>> >> The ✘ at the top means no podlingnamesearch was found (hover over it
>> >> to see the tooltip).
>> >>
>> >> Anirudh Kondaveeti's id is incorrect (the correct id is akondave)
>> >>
>> >> Orhan Kışlal's name doesn't match the name in LDAP (which is recorded
>> >> as Orhan Kislal, note the s).
>> >>
>> >> Not that it is a problem, but I note that MADlib's PPMC roster was
>> >> never set up.  I mention that as (per below) it is a check that now
>> >> occurs to me should be added.
>> >>
>> >> > - Atlas isn't processing as an establish (not sure why)
>> >>
>> >> Email addresses aren't enclosed in <>s, and the lines aren't preceded
>> >> by an asterisk.  Note that this parsed list was by the tlp establish
>> >> infra tool; but that need may soon go away with the changes in LDAP.
>> >> In any case, the failure to parse this list means that the
>> >> cross-checks that the board agenda tool does to see if ids are valid
>> >> and names match aren't performed.
>> >>
>> >> Not checked by the current board agenda tool, but I note that the
>> >> people listed as Atlas committers in LDAP are being proposed as PPMC
>> >> members in the resolution.
>> >>
>> >> The quotes around the chair's name may cause it to not match the email
>> >> addresses once they are fixed.
>> >>
>> >> > - Mynewt only picks up Justin's name, no one else's
>> >>
>> >> No asterisks, extra comma at the end of lines.  Again, committers are
>> >> listed as proposed PMC members.
>> >>
>> > Committers being added to the PMC shouldn't be an issue.
>>
>> This piques my curiosity: why weren't they added to the PPMC prior to
>> graduation then?  What is the purpose between distinguishing between
>> PPMC and committers during incubation?
>>
>>
> I've asked that question as well.  Will wait on a response.
>
> I think distinguishing is the as why we do it on TLPs.  We've marked the
> ideal of having everyone be on the PPMC, but some people feel it important
> to distinguish.
>
>
>> It somehow seems more likely that there was a communication problems
>> somewhere along the line and the people who drafted these proposals
>> don't have the same understanding as the board (and, for that matter,
>> existing infrastructure tools) as to what this list is intended to
>> mean.
>>
>
> I'm not sure what you mean.

I may not have said it clearly, but I think we are agreeing: was the
intent to move all committers to PMC members at this time, or was
there a misunderstanding as to the purpose of this list.  You said
that you asked this question, I'll leave that to you to pursue.

>> Once added to the PMC, these individuals will have access to PMC
>> private mailing list archives.
>>
>> In any case, much of what the board agenda tool reports is only
>> advisory.  For example, the board may chose to approve the graduation
>> despite the lack of a podlingnamesearch.
>>
>
> I'm not comfortable without the PNS.  And it looks like 2 of the graduates
> are missing it :/

That's why it was added (it was Shane's suggestion).  I agree that it
is a matter of comfort: the board may chose to proceed anyway.  But
perhaps incubator procedures should be examined to see if this should
be surfaced earlier?

- Sam Ruby

>> >> Justin is found as he is listed as the chair.
>> >>
>> >> > John
>> >>
>> >> P.S.  The roster tool has a button at the bottom of PPMC pages which
>> >> helps generate a correctly formatted establish resolution.  At the
>> >> moment, it only presents the resolution, which can be copied/pasted.
>> >> It could have an option to post the resolution, either to the
>> >> incubator mailing list for a vote or to the board agenda itself.
>>
>> - Sam Ruby
>>

Re: Current board agenda might be broken

["John D. Ament" <jo...@apache.org>]

On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 9:13 AM Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net> wrote:

> On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 9:06 AM, John D. Ament <jo...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 7:52 AM Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net> wrote:
> >
> >> On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 7:12 AM, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
> >> wrote:
> >> > Not sure what could have caused it.
> >> >
> >> > - MADlib looks correct
> >>
> >> The ✘ at the top means no podlingnamesearch was found (hover over it
> >> to see the tooltip).
> >>
> >> Anirudh Kondaveeti's id is incorrect (the correct id is akondave)
> >>
> >> Orhan Kışlal's name doesn't match the name in LDAP (which is recorded
> >> as Orhan Kislal, note the s).
> >>
> >> Not that it is a problem, but I note that MADlib's PPMC roster was
> >> never set up.  I mention that as (per below) it is a check that now
> >> occurs to me should be added.
> >>
> >> > - Atlas isn't processing as an establish (not sure why)
> >>
> >> Email addresses aren't enclosed in <>s, and the lines aren't preceded
> >> by an asterisk.  Note that this parsed list was by the tlp establish
> >> infra tool; but that need may soon go away with the changes in LDAP.
> >> In any case, the failure to parse this list means that the
> >> cross-checks that the board agenda tool does to see if ids are valid
> >> and names match aren't performed.
> >>
> >> Not checked by the current board agenda tool, but I note that the
> >> people listed as Atlas committers in LDAP are being proposed as PPMC
> >> members in the resolution.
> >>
> >> The quotes around the chair's name may cause it to not match the email
> >> addresses once they are fixed.
> >>
> >> > - Mynewt only picks up Justin's name, no one else's
> >>
> >> No asterisks, extra comma at the end of lines.  Again, committers are
> >> listed as proposed PMC members.
> >>
> > Committers being added to the PMC shouldn't be an issue.
>
> This piques my curiosity: why weren't they added to the PPMC prior to
> graduation then?  What is the purpose between distinguishing between
> PPMC and committers during incubation?
>
>
I've asked that question as well.  Will wait on a response.

I think distinguishing is the as why we do it on TLPs.  We've marked the
ideal of having everyone be on the PPMC, but some people feel it important
to distinguish.


> It somehow seems more likely that there was a communication problems
> somewhere along the line and the people who drafted these proposals
> don't have the same understanding as the board (and, for that matter,
> existing infrastructure tools) as to what this list is intended to
> mean.
>

I'm not sure what you mean.


>
> Once added to the PMC, these individuals will have access to PMC
> private mailing list archives.
>
> In any case, much of what the board agenda tool reports is only
> advisory.  For example, the board may chose to approve the graduation
> despite the lack of a podlingnamesearch.
>

I'm not comfortable without the PNS.  And it looks like 2 of the graduates
are missing it :/


>
> >> Justin is found as he is listed as the chair.
> >>
> >> > John
> >>
> >> P.S.  The roster tool has a button at the bottom of PPMC pages which
> >> helps generate a correctly formatted establish resolution.  At the
> >> moment, it only presents the resolution, which can be copied/pasted.
> >> It could have an option to post the resolution, either to the
> >> incubator mailing list for a vote or to the board agenda itself.
>
> - Sam Ruby
>

Re: Current board agenda might be broken

[Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net>]

On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 9:06 AM, John D. Ament <jo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 7:52 AM Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 7:12 AM, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
>> wrote:
>> > Not sure what could have caused it.
>> >
>> > - MADlib looks correct
>>
>> The ✘ at the top means no podlingnamesearch was found (hover over it
>> to see the tooltip).
>>
>> Anirudh Kondaveeti's id is incorrect (the correct id is akondave)
>>
>> Orhan Kışlal's name doesn't match the name in LDAP (which is recorded
>> as Orhan Kislal, note the s).
>>
>> Not that it is a problem, but I note that MADlib's PPMC roster was
>> never set up.  I mention that as (per below) it is a check that now
>> occurs to me should be added.
>>
>> > - Atlas isn't processing as an establish (not sure why)
>>
>> Email addresses aren't enclosed in <>s, and the lines aren't preceded
>> by an asterisk.  Note that this parsed list was by the tlp establish
>> infra tool; but that need may soon go away with the changes in LDAP.
>> In any case, the failure to parse this list means that the
>> cross-checks that the board agenda tool does to see if ids are valid
>> and names match aren't performed.
>>
>> Not checked by the current board agenda tool, but I note that the
>> people listed as Atlas committers in LDAP are being proposed as PPMC
>> members in the resolution.
>>
>> The quotes around the chair's name may cause it to not match the email
>> addresses once they are fixed.
>>
>> > - Mynewt only picks up Justin's name, no one else's
>>
>> No asterisks, extra comma at the end of lines.  Again, committers are
>> listed as proposed PMC members.
>>
> Committers being added to the PMC shouldn't be an issue.

This piques my curiosity: why weren't they added to the PPMC prior to
graduation then?  What is the purpose between distinguishing between
PPMC and committers during incubation?

It somehow seems more likely that there was a communication problems
somewhere along the line and the people who drafted these proposals
don't have the same understanding as the board (and, for that matter,
existing infrastructure tools) as to what this list is intended to
mean.

Once added to the PMC, these individuals will have access to PMC
private mailing list archives.

In any case, much of what the board agenda tool reports is only
advisory.  For example, the board may chose to approve the graduation
despite the lack of a podlingnamesearch.

>> Justin is found as he is listed as the chair.
>>
>> > John
>>
>> P.S.  The roster tool has a button at the bottom of PPMC pages which
>> helps generate a correctly formatted establish resolution.  At the
>> moment, it only presents the resolution, which can be copied/pasted.
>> It could have an option to post the resolution, either to the
>> incubator mailing list for a vote or to the board agenda itself.

- Sam Ruby

Re: Current board agenda might be broken

["John D. Ament" <jo...@gmail.com>]

On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 7:52 AM Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net> wrote:

> On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 7:12 AM, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
> wrote:
> > Not sure what could have caused it.
> >
> > - MADlib looks correct
>
> The ✘ at the top means no podlingnamesearch was found (hover over it
> to see the tooltip).
>
> Anirudh Kondaveeti's id is incorrect (the correct id is akondave)
>
> Orhan Kışlal's name doesn't match the name in LDAP (which is recorded
> as Orhan Kislal, note the s).
>
> Not that it is a problem, but I note that MADlib's PPMC roster was
> never set up.  I mention that as (per below) it is a check that now
> occurs to me should be added.
>
> > - Atlas isn't processing as an establish (not sure why)
>
> Email addresses aren't enclosed in <>s, and the lines aren't preceded
> by an asterisk.  Note that this parsed list was by the tlp establish
> infra tool; but that need may soon go away with the changes in LDAP.
> In any case, the failure to parse this list means that the
> cross-checks that the board agenda tool does to see if ids are valid
> and names match aren't performed.
>
> Not checked by the current board agenda tool, but I note that the
> people listed as Atlas committers in LDAP are being proposed as PPMC
> members in the resolution.
>
> The quotes around the chair's name may cause it to not match the email
> addresses once they are fixed.
>
> > - Mynewt only picks up Justin's name, no one else's
>
> No asterisks, extra comma at the end of lines.  Again, committers are
> listed as proposed PMC members.
>
>
Committers being added to the PMC shouldn't be an issue.


> Justin is found as he is listed as the chair.
>
> > John
>
> P.S.  The roster tool has a button at the bottom of PPMC pages which
> helps generate a correctly formatted establish resolution.  At the
> moment, it only presents the resolution, which can be copied/pasted.
> It could have an option to post the resolution, either to the
> incubator mailing list for a vote or to the board agenda itself.
>

Re: Current board agenda might be broken

[Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net>]

On Thu, Jun 15, 2017 at 7:12 AM, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> Not sure what could have caused it.
>
> - MADlib looks correct

The ✘ at the top means no podlingnamesearch was found (hover over it
to see the tooltip).

Anirudh Kondaveeti's id is incorrect (the correct id is akondave)

Orhan Kışlal's name doesn't match the name in LDAP (which is recorded
as Orhan Kislal, note the s).

Not that it is a problem, but I note that MADlib's PPMC roster was
never set up.  I mention that as (per below) it is a check that now
occurs to me should be added.

> - Atlas isn't processing as an establish (not sure why)

Email addresses aren't enclosed in <>s, and the lines aren't preceded
by an asterisk.  Note that this parsed list was by the tlp establish
infra tool; but that need may soon go away with the changes in LDAP.
In any case, the failure to parse this list means that the
cross-checks that the board agenda tool does to see if ids are valid
and names match aren't performed.

Not checked by the current board agenda tool, but I note that the
people listed as Atlas committers in LDAP are being proposed as PPMC
members in the resolution.

The quotes around the chair's name may cause it to not match the email
addresses once they are fixed.

> - Mynewt only picks up Justin's name, no one else's

No asterisks, extra comma at the end of lines.  Again, committers are
listed as proposed PMC members.

Justin is found as he is listed as the chair.

> John

P.S.  The roster tool has a button at the bottom of PPMC pages which
helps generate a correctly formatted establish resolution.  At the
moment, it only presents the resolution, which can be copied/pasted.
It could have an option to post the resolution, either to the
incubator mailing list for a vote or to the board agenda itself.