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Posted to dev@community.apache.org by Shane Curcuru <as...@shanecurcuru.org> on 2023/02/07 22:50:54 UTC
Idea: build a New Contributor Guide Tool
I've been burnt out for a while at trying to answer newcomer's
questions. It's not scalable, and even when I do the work to not answer
a question - but instead send a link to the doc where the answer is -
it's still tedious.
So I finally thought: why don't we try to automate some part of this?
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/COMDEV/New+Contributor+Guidance+Tool
There are a million things we could do to make newcomers more welcome
and feel confident they can find a place they might fit. This is just
one, but it's one I'm hoping other folks are interested in helping to build.
Feel free to discuss here; and please join in on the wiki to crystalize
what thing we might actually build that would help guide a complete
newcomer to someplace they might find interesting. Besides being a
really cool tool, it'd save Maxim a lot of time!
--
- Shane
ComDev PMC
The Apache Software Foundation
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Re: Idea: build a New Contributor Guide Tool
Posted by Jarek Potiuk <ja...@potiuk.com>.
Yep. That's what those chatbots can do now. And what's even more
interesting, the answers it gives are getting deeper and deeper (and
more accurate) as long as you ask more refined questions.
There are of course risks involved, but I am equally impressive how
good and legible answers the bots provide, and I am sure in the (near)
future when chat-bot war from Open AI, Google and others inevitably
gets into full-blown competition, I am sure we will be able to make
the bots focused on the material we already have even better.
On Wed, Feb 8, 2023 at 8:37 PM Ayush Saxena <ay...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> That sounds so cool and magical Craig🙂
> OpenAi seems pretty smart, Impressive!!!
>
> Makes sense to me to do some improvemenrs there (If my opinion counts), that might be very helpfull may not be very much immediately but for sure in the near future.
>
> -Ayush
>
> >
> > On 09-Feb-2023, at 12:50 AM, Craig Russell <ap...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > As an experiment, I logged into chat.openai.com and asked it to tell me how to contribute code to Apache. [1] Then I asked why the ICLA is needed. [2]
> >
> > These AI are smarter than we might think,
> >
> > I expect that refining the questions and editing the replies might be easier than creating the content by hand.
> >
> > WDYAT?
> >
> > Craig
> >
> > [1]I asked:
> >
> > how do i contribute code to The Apache Software Foundation?
> >
> > They replied:
> >
> > To contribute code to the Apache Software Foundation (ASF), you need to follow these steps:
> >
> > Choose a project: Browse the list of Apache projects and find one that aligns with your area of expertise.
> >
> > Get involved: Participate in the project's community by asking questions, contributing documentation, and providing feedback.
> >
> > Set up your development environment: Follow the project's guidelines for setting up your development environment.
> >
> > Sign and submit an ICLA: The Apache Software Foundation requires contributors to sign a Contributor License Agreement (CLA). This document outlines your rights and obligations as a contributor to the ASF.
> >
> > Create a patch or feature branch: Develop your changes in a separate branch and submit a patch or feature request to the project's mailing list or issue tracker.
> >
> > Follow the project's coding standards: Ensure that your code follows the project's coding standards and style guide.
> >
> > Engage in code review: Be prepared to engage in a code review process with other project contributors.
> >
> > Merge your changes: Once your changes have been reviewed and approved, they will be merged into the project's main codebase.
> >
> > Note: The specifics of the contribution process may vary from project to project, so be sure to consult the project's guidelines for more information.
> >
> > [2] why is an ICLA needed for Apache?
> >
> > The Apache Software Foundation requires contributors to sign a Contributor License Agreement (CLA) in order to ensure that the code contributed to its projects can be distributed under the terms of the Apache License. The Apache License is a permissive open-source license that allows for the use, modification, and distribution of software, but requires that the original copyright notices and license terms are preserved.
> >
> > The ICLA is a legal agreement between the contributor and the ASF that clarifies the rights and responsibilities of both parties. By signing the ICLA, the contributor grants the ASF a perpetual, non-exclusive, no-charge, worldwide license to use, copy, modify, distribute, and sublicense the contribution, and agrees to hold the ASF harmless from any claims related to the contribution.
> >
> > The ICLA helps the ASF to maintain a clear chain of custody for the code in its projects, and protects the integrity of the Apache brand by ensuring that all contributions are made in accordance with the ASF's legal and ethical standards.
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@community.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@community.apache.org
> >
>
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Re: Idea: build a New Contributor Guide Tool
Posted by Ayush Saxena <ay...@gmail.com>.
That sounds so cool and magical Craig🙂
OpenAi seems pretty smart, Impressive!!!
Makes sense to me to do some improvemenrs there (If my opinion counts), that might be very helpfull may not be very much immediately but for sure in the near future.
-Ayush
>
> On 09-Feb-2023, at 12:50 AM, Craig Russell <ap...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> As an experiment, I logged into chat.openai.com and asked it to tell me how to contribute code to Apache. [1] Then I asked why the ICLA is needed. [2]
>
> These AI are smarter than we might think,
>
> I expect that refining the questions and editing the replies might be easier than creating the content by hand.
>
> WDYAT?
>
> Craig
>
> [1]I asked:
>
> how do i contribute code to The Apache Software Foundation?
>
> They replied:
>
> To contribute code to the Apache Software Foundation (ASF), you need to follow these steps:
>
> Choose a project: Browse the list of Apache projects and find one that aligns with your area of expertise.
>
> Get involved: Participate in the project's community by asking questions, contributing documentation, and providing feedback.
>
> Set up your development environment: Follow the project's guidelines for setting up your development environment.
>
> Sign and submit an ICLA: The Apache Software Foundation requires contributors to sign a Contributor License Agreement (CLA). This document outlines your rights and obligations as a contributor to the ASF.
>
> Create a patch or feature branch: Develop your changes in a separate branch and submit a patch or feature request to the project's mailing list or issue tracker.
>
> Follow the project's coding standards: Ensure that your code follows the project's coding standards and style guide.
>
> Engage in code review: Be prepared to engage in a code review process with other project contributors.
>
> Merge your changes: Once your changes have been reviewed and approved, they will be merged into the project's main codebase.
>
> Note: The specifics of the contribution process may vary from project to project, so be sure to consult the project's guidelines for more information.
>
> [2] why is an ICLA needed for Apache?
>
> The Apache Software Foundation requires contributors to sign a Contributor License Agreement (CLA) in order to ensure that the code contributed to its projects can be distributed under the terms of the Apache License. The Apache License is a permissive open-source license that allows for the use, modification, and distribution of software, but requires that the original copyright notices and license terms are preserved.
>
> The ICLA is a legal agreement between the contributor and the ASF that clarifies the rights and responsibilities of both parties. By signing the ICLA, the contributor grants the ASF a perpetual, non-exclusive, no-charge, worldwide license to use, copy, modify, distribute, and sublicense the contribution, and agrees to hold the ASF harmless from any claims related to the contribution.
>
> The ICLA helps the ASF to maintain a clear chain of custody for the code in its projects, and protects the integrity of the Apache brand by ensuring that all contributions are made in accordance with the ASF's legal and ethical standards.
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@community.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@community.apache.org
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@community.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@community.apache.org
Re: Idea: build a New Contributor Guide Tool
Posted by Craig Russell <ap...@gmail.com>.
As an experiment, I logged into chat.openai.com and asked it to tell me how to contribute code to Apache. [1] Then I asked why the ICLA is needed. [2]
These AI are smarter than we might think,
I expect that refining the questions and editing the replies might be easier than creating the content by hand.
WDYAT?
Craig
[1]I asked:
how do i contribute code to The Apache Software Foundation?
They replied:
To contribute code to the Apache Software Foundation (ASF), you need to follow these steps:
Choose a project: Browse the list of Apache projects and find one that aligns with your area of expertise.
Get involved: Participate in the project's community by asking questions, contributing documentation, and providing feedback.
Set up your development environment: Follow the project's guidelines for setting up your development environment.
Sign and submit an ICLA: The Apache Software Foundation requires contributors to sign a Contributor License Agreement (CLA). This document outlines your rights and obligations as a contributor to the ASF.
Create a patch or feature branch: Develop your changes in a separate branch and submit a patch or feature request to the project's mailing list or issue tracker.
Follow the project's coding standards: Ensure that your code follows the project's coding standards and style guide.
Engage in code review: Be prepared to engage in a code review process with other project contributors.
Merge your changes: Once your changes have been reviewed and approved, they will be merged into the project's main codebase.
Note: The specifics of the contribution process may vary from project to project, so be sure to consult the project's guidelines for more information.
[2] why is an ICLA needed for Apache?
The Apache Software Foundation requires contributors to sign a Contributor License Agreement (CLA) in order to ensure that the code contributed to its projects can be distributed under the terms of the Apache License. The Apache License is a permissive open-source license that allows for the use, modification, and distribution of software, but requires that the original copyright notices and license terms are preserved.
The ICLA is a legal agreement between the contributor and the ASF that clarifies the rights and responsibilities of both parties. By signing the ICLA, the contributor grants the ASF a perpetual, non-exclusive, no-charge, worldwide license to use, copy, modify, distribute, and sublicense the contribution, and agrees to hold the ASF harmless from any claims related to the contribution.
The ICLA helps the ASF to maintain a clear chain of custody for the code in its projects, and protects the integrity of the Apache brand by ensuring that all contributions are made in accordance with the ASF's legal and ethical standards.
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Re: Idea: build a New Contributor Guide Tool
Posted by Shane Curcuru <as...@shanecurcuru.org>.
Yeah, in terms of using some AI tool here... I haven't had enough hot
caffeinated beverage yet to even think about it. But one thing:
Jarek Potiuk wrote on 2/8/23 7:08 AM:
...snip...
> I looked at the proposal and with the CYOA engines, one of the
> problems is that you have to script it and investi in defining the
> paths/branches
I don't see the scripting being that hard, presuming we have a decent
CYOA language. The end path from the script doesn't have to be the One
Best Project For You, it just needs to be a selection of projects that
might be relevant for you.
So coding languages questions merely add to a list like "user can
program in X,Y,Z". Then at the end, we use that as a filter on
projects.a.o to come up with the potential list of projects we'd show
the user.
Each set of questions is only a filter function based on some general
criteria from project data. At the end show all the projects that meet
the filters.
Obviously we also handle non-coding paths, and may have some standard
"Here's How To Go About Finding A New Bug" help text embedded in the
script, or directly linked, so the person can find other useful
resources along the way.
Does that make sense? I'm obviously hand-waving about the issue that
projects.a.o data may not be complete yet. 8-)
--
- Shane
ComDev PMC
The Apache Software Foundation
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Re: Idea: build a New Contributor Guide Tool
Posted by Jarek Potiuk <ja...@potiuk.com>.
I had some interesting discussions about it at FOSDEM and similar
topics popped up - how to make first-time/new contributor onboarding
more engaging and welcoming and helped, but at the same time not to
over-burden ourselves with mostly repetitive questions/answers.
And I would love to carry this conversation here as well.
I looked at the proposal and with the CYOA engines, one of the
problems is that you have to script it and investi in defining the
paths/branches, but with the recent development in the AI tools (hello
Chat-GPT) - maybe we do not have to do it.
Ut might be controversial, but I think one option that we **might**
consider (and I am very cautiously dropping it here - without strongly
supporting it - just as an idea) to use some AI engine/chatbot to
help.
I believe we just passed the level where answers from such chatbots
are much more useful and correct (and legible) than even several
months ago. They are mostly correct, there is a lot of "caution"
introduced by those who develop the engines to avoid a number of
pitfalls from the past. And I imagine, if you feed such a bot with
previous conversations of ours (hey they are all public!) both the
range of questions/answers and useful answers such bot could "serve"
might be way, way better and wider (and might be reinforced
conrinuously with real "new" conversations) than anything we could
ever do with scripting. For me this might be really like every "human"
answer we have is automatically building a new path and adventure in
such CYOA engine.
Of course - that shoudl be clear that the bot is not human answering
(this was at least the conclusion of FOSDEM discussions I had). We
(humans) have to watch the conversations to correct problems if the
answer is wrong and probably a multitude of other things.
And there are risks of dehumanising such conversations, so we should
likely carefully make sure that there is human-in-the-loop at the
moments where it is really needed.
And maybe somehow we could combine the two - CYOA engine with some
basic adventure openers + ChatBot. I am pretty sure the CYOA engine
developers - see the writing on the wall, and the AI models will be -
hopefully - more and more open and easier (and cheaper) to use, so
maybe simply CYOA engine choice that you dicsuss in the docs Shane,
shoudl be chosen based on current/future ChatBot/AI integration.
No concrete proposal yet, I am just wondering if this is a topic that
people have strong opinions about :).
J.
On Tue, Feb 7, 2023 at 11:51 PM Shane Curcuru <as...@shanecurcuru.org> wrote:
>
> I've been burnt out for a while at trying to answer newcomer's
> questions. It's not scalable, and even when I do the work to not answer
> a question - but instead send a link to the doc where the answer is -
> it's still tedious.
>
> So I finally thought: why don't we try to automate some part of this?
>
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/COMDEV/New+Contributor+Guidance+Tool
>
> There are a million things we could do to make newcomers more welcome
> and feel confident they can find a place they might fit. This is just
> one, but it's one I'm hoping other folks are interested in helping to build.
>
> Feel free to discuss here; and please join in on the wiki to crystalize
> what thing we might actually build that would help guide a complete
> newcomer to someplace they might find interesting. Besides being a
> really cool tool, it'd save Maxim a lot of time!
>
> --
> - Shane
> ComDev PMC
> The Apache Software Foundation
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@community.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@community.apache.org
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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