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Posted to log4j-cvs@jakarta.apache.org by ce...@apache.org on 2001/06/13 21:44:49 UTC
cvs commit: jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support AbeMirrashidi.html AlexBlewitt.html AndersKristensen.html AndyDePue.html BrentSprecher.html CarlBacher.html ChristopherTaylor.html CourtDemas.html DanTanner.html DavidMaharaj.html DavidOwens.html EllisTeer.html EndreStolsvik.html EoinFlood.html GuyLichtman.html HenrikFredholm.html HenrikLundahl.html HenryLi.html JamesProkash.html JasonHeirtzler.html JasonKitcat.html JoeLoda.html Joh Munsch.html JohnMunsch.html JohnVolkar.html JonStevens.html KnutErikBallestad.html MichaelMoser.html MichaelStacey.html NelsonMinar.html PaulGrinchenko.html RalfHaug.html RichardWilliams.html RobertMahoney.html RonJacobs.html StacyCurl.html SteveWingfield.html ThomasFenner.html TonyDean.html WilliamJaynes.html index.html
ceki 01/06/13 12:44:48
Modified: docs critique.html
Added: docs/pub-support AbeMirrashidi.html AlexBlewitt.html
AndersKristensen.html AndyDePue.html
BrentSprecher.html CarlBacher.html
ChristopherTaylor.html CourtDemas.html
DanTanner.html DavidMaharaj.html DavidOwens.html
EllisTeer.html EndreStolsvik.html EoinFlood.html
GuyLichtman.html HenrikFredholm.html
HenrikLundahl.html HenryLi.html JamesProkash.html
JasonHeirtzler.html JasonKitcat.html JoeLoda.html
Joh Munsch.html JohnMunsch.html JohnVolkar.html
JonStevens.html KnutErikBallestad.html
MichaelMoser.html MichaelStacey.html
NelsonMinar.html PaulGrinchenko.html RalfHaug.html
RichardWilliams.html RobertMahoney.html
RonJacobs.html StacyCurl.html SteveWingfield.html
ThomasFenner.html TonyDean.html WilliamJaynes.html
index.html
Log:
Added the support emails we have received so far.
Revision Changes Path
1.3 +61 -22 jakarta-log4j/docs/critique.html
Index: critique.html
===================================================================
RCS file: /home/cvs/jakarta-log4j/docs/critique.html,v
retrieving revision 1.2
retrieving revision 1.3
diff -u -r1.2 -r1.3
--- critique.html 2001/06/13 00:20:32 1.2
+++ critique.html 2001/06/13 19:44:38 1.3
@@ -25,7 +25,7 @@
<p>Before delving into the details, some historical perspective is in
order. I am the founder of the log4j project. I participated in the
-specification of the JSR47 API although not as an expert. In 1999, I
+specification of the JSR47 API, although not as an expert. In 1999, I
was still working for IBM and big blue had already Chris Barlock as a
member in the JSR47 experts group. Chris is the author of <a
href="http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/tech/loggingtoolkit4j">IBM's
@@ -35,12 +35,12 @@
API. In particular, the two share the same basic components, namely
loggers, levels, handlers and formatters. In log4j, these components
are called categories, priorities, appenders and layouts
-respectively. Pairwise, they are similar in purpose. As such, the
+respectively. Pairwise, they are identical in purpose. As such, the
terms logger and category, level and priority, handler and appender,
formatter and layout will be used interchangeably in the remainder of
this document.
-<p>Even after a casual glance it should be apparent that the log4j and
+<p>Even after a casual review it should be apparent that the log4j and
JSR47 APIs are <em>very</em> similar. For one, they are the only
logging APIs which are based on a named hierarchy. If you understand
one API, then understanding the other is trivial. There are
@@ -58,11 +58,11 @@
contains a link to its parent but a parent does not have links to its
children.
-<p>At first glance, this might look like a trivial implementation
+<p>At first glance, this might look like a mundane implementation
detail but it is actually quite fundamental.
<ol>
-<p><b><li>Configutation order matters</b>
+<p><b><li>Configuration order matters</b>
<p>In JSR47, when you set the level of a logger, say
<code>wombat</code>, JSR47 traverses the tree below
@@ -75,11 +75,11 @@
of a single field. Children categories dynamically inherit the
priority of their parent by traversing the hierarchy tree upwards.
-<p>It follows that if you configure the level for logger "foo.bar1"
-before configuring the level for "foo", then the latter instruction
-will overwrite the first. It will be as if the first instruction for
-configuring "foo.bar1" had never existed. This is not a show stopper
-but it will bite you time and again.
+<p>It follows that with JSR47 if you configure the level for logger
+"foo.bar1" before configuring the level for "foo", then the latter
+instruction will overwrite the first. It will be as if the first
+instruction for configuring "foo.bar1" had never existed. This is not
+a show stopper but it will bite you time and again.
<p>In log4j, categories can be configured in any order. Thus, you do
not have to worry about configuration order.
@@ -112,6 +112,8 @@
at a time making resource bundles and hence internationalization quite
unmanageable.
+</ol>
+
<h2>Bogus Levels</h2>
<p>JSR 47 defines the levels <code>ALL</code>, <code>SEVERE</code>,
@@ -141,17 +143,18 @@
JMS channels, automatically generate email etc. It can roll log files
by size or date and log asynchronously.
-<p>JSR47 can log to the console, to files and to a memory buffer.
+<p>JSR47 can log to the console, to files, to sockets and to a memory
+buffer.
<p>Log4j has an extensible and powerful layout called the
-PatternLayout. JSR47 offers the much weaker
+<code>PatternLayout</code>. JSR47 offers the much weaker
<code>SimpleFormatter</code> as an alternative.
<p>Log4j supports configuration through property files as well as XML
documents. JSR47 currently admits only property files. Moreover, the
-language of JSR47 configuration files is very weak. For example, you
+language of JSR47 configuration files is very weak. In particular, you
can only configure one instance of a given handler class. <em>This
-means that you can log to jsut one file at a time.</em>
+means that you can log to just one file at a time.</em>
<p>There are many other details in which log4j differs from
JSR47. Even if the log4j core is small, the project contains a total
@@ -163,6 +166,37 @@
day. Log4j has been ported to C++ and Python. Commercial companies
provide products based on log4j.
+<p>By the way, log4j runs fine under JDK 1.1. JSR 47 will run under
+JDK 1.4 and only under JDK 1.4.
+
+<h2>Error Handling</h2>
+
+In JSR 47 when an error occurs then either a
+<code>RunTimeException</code> is thrown to the user or (in handlers
+only) an internal field is set. In the first case, the
+<code>RunTimeException</code> will cause your application to crash. In
+the latter case, you can retrieve the last caught exception in the
+handler checking the <code>getException</code> method of that
+handler. <em>The former is totally unacceptable while the latter is
+impractical.</em>
+
+<p>In log4j, under no circumstances are exceptions thrown at the
+user. However, all appenders have an associated
+<code>ErrorHandler</code>. This <code>ErrorHandler</code> is invoked
+by the appender whenever a handler-specific error occurs. By default,
+log4j appenders are associated with an
+<code>OnlyOnceErrorHandler</code> which emits a message on the console
+for the first error in an appender and ignoring all following errors.
+
+<p>An <code>ErrorHandler</code> can implement an arbitrary error
+handling policy. For example, after a failure to write to a database a
+<code>JDBCAppender</code> can be redirected to fall back on a
+<code>FileAppender</code>. This functionality is supported in XML
+configuration files. You do not need to change a single line of client
+code.
+
+<p>But again who cares about errors right?
+
<h2>Performance</h2>
<p>In log4j, caller localization information is optional. In JSR47 it
@@ -172,15 +206,20 @@
<h2>Lobby Sun</h2>
-
-<p>If you feel that these differences are imporant, then this is your
-chance to lobby Sun to adopt log4j as the logging API shipped in JDK
-1.4 or <b>at the least change the way parents and children loggers
-interact.</b> This is an implementation detail and does not affect the
-public API. Please direct your polite and personalized request to <a
-href="mailto:java-logging-input@eng.sun.com">java-logging-input@eng.sun.com</a>.
-<p>
+<p>If you feel that these differences are important, then this is your
+chance to lobby Sun to adopt log4j as the logging API shipped with JDK
+1.4. The JSR47 API is still at the public-review stage meaning that it
+can still be modified. In six months time whining about JSR47 will be
+too late.
+
+<p>Please direct your polite and personalized request to <a
+href="mailto:java-logging-input@eng.sun.com">java-logging-input@eng.sun.com</a>
+with a cc: to <a href="mailto:cgu@qos.ch">cgu@qos.ch</a>.
+
+<p>You may wish to look at a <a
+href="pub-support/index.html">compilation</a> of previous requests
+sent to Sun by our community.
</body>
</HTML>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/AbeMirrashidi.html
Index: AbeMirrashidi.html
===================================================================
<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 10:11:07 -0700 (PDT) <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Abe Mirrashidi <abe@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: <java-logging-input@eng.sun.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: JSR 47 <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>I have been using log4j for nearly a year now and it is a quite robust
and</DIV>
<DIV>widely used API. It is great that Sun is incorporating logging into
the</DIV>
<DIV>jdk, but quite ridiculous to include an inferior, brand new,
unadopted</DIV>
<DIV>standard. It makes much more sense to adopt log4j as the de jure
standard,</DIV>
<DIV>as it is already the de facto standard.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Sincerely yours,</DIV>
<DIV>Abraham Mirrashidi</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/AlexBlewitt.html
Index: AlexBlewitt.html
===================================================================
<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 14:58:14 +0100 (BST) <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Alex Blewitt <Alex.Blewitt@ioshq.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Sender: ukasb001@krud.int.ioshq.com
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: mailto: ; <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: Log4J as standard logging mechanism <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>I am writing to let you know that I believe there are some
fundamental</DIV>
<DIV>flaws in the logging mechanism currently shipped with JDK 1.4. I
believe</DIV>
<DIV>that these are well summarised in the document</DIV>
<DIV> <A href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A></DIV><BR>
<DIV>In particular, multiple debugging levels (FINE, FINER, FINEST) are
very</DIV>
<DIV>difficult to separate in real terms.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Additionally, having looked through the source code of both Log4J and
the</DIV>
<DIV>associated JSR 47 specification, I believe that more work and test
hours</DIV>
<DIV>have gone into the Log4J rather than JSR specifications.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>As such, I believe that you should consider adopting the de-facto
standard</DIV>
<DIV>of Log4J as the logging utility in Java, rather than settle for
second</DIV>
<DIV>best.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Regards,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Alex Blewitt.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>/***************************************************************\</DIV>
<DIV>|* Alex
Blewitt * Hug, and the world hugs with you
*|</DIV>
<DIV>|* Alex.Blewitt@ioshq.com
*
*|</DIV>
<DIV>|* Mobile: +44 7966 158 647 * Spread a little
happiness *|</DIV>
<DIV>\***************************************************************/</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/AndersKristensen.html
Index: AndersKristensen.html
===================================================================
<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 13:07:25 -0400 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Anders Kristensen <akristensen@dynamicsoft.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0;
U) <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Accept-Language: en <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: Ceki G�lc� <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: JSR 47 vs log4j <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Hi,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>This is to let you guys on the JSR 47 expert group know that I agree</DIV>
<DIV>with most of the points brought up by Ceki in his discussion of JSR
47:</DIV><BR>
<DIV> <A href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A></DIV><BR>
<DIV>I guess it's not essential to have the JSR 47 API be all singing, all</DIV>
<DIV>dancing in its first incarnation, but it would be unfortunate if the</DIV>
<DIV>design precludes the sort of improvements mentioned by Ceki in later</DIV>
<DIV>versions (and while I haven't looked very closely at JSR 47, I
suspect</DIV>
<DIV>many more points could be made).</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Regards,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Anders Kristensen</DIV>
<DIV>logj4 developer and spec lead for JSR 116</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/AndyDePue.html
Index: AndyDePue.html
===================================================================
<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: Request to use log4j as Java logging standard
instead of JSR 47. <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To:
java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release
5.0.3 March 21, 2000 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>From:
AndyDePue@kyrus.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001
10:21:33 -0700 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-MIMETrack: Serialize by
Router on GV-TYR/GV/Kyrus(Release 5.0.3 |March 21, 2000) at 06/13/2001
<BR> 01:19:57 PM <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Hello,</DIV><BR>
<DIV> I have been involved on at least ten projects where logging has
been</DIV>
<DIV>necessary. With this much experience logging (both building
logging</DIV>
<DIV>libraries and using third party libraries), I can tell you that when
I</DIV>
<DIV>discovered log4j, I had never seen anything like it. It is, simply,
the</DIV>
<DIV>best logging package I have ever used. Not just the big things, but
the</DIV>
<DIV>little details are what make it great. After a thorough review of JSR
47,</DIV>
<DIV>I see it falls short on many of these details. In all honesty, if
JSR47</DIV>
<DIV>became the logging standard, I would never use it as long as log4j
still</DIV>
<DIV>existed in an up-to-date state.</DIV>
<DIV> Please have mercy on us developers and heed this appeal!</DIV><BR>
<DIV> Sincerely,</DIV>
<DIV>
Andy DePue</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/BrentSprecher.html
Index: BrentSprecher.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: "Brent Sprecher" <brent@servidium.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: <java-logging-input@eng.sun.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: Logging API concerns.
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 10:24:43 -0600
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express
5.50.4133.2400 <BR></SPAN><BR><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<META content="MSHTML 5.50.4522.1801" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Dear sir or madam,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>As a current log4j user and developer, I feel the
need to comment on the JRS47 logging API. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The company I work for has produced a Swing based
GUI that leverages the power of log4j and provides developers with a
sophisticated logging interface for managing log messages. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I am currently in the process of extending our
application to plug into the JDK 1.4 beta java.util.logging package, and have
frankly been quite dissapointed. A number of basic features that I have come to
expect from a logging package are missing or poorly implemented.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>In particular, the way that Level inheritance and
Handler inheritance are implemented makes using this package awkward at best. At
the very least, you should consider implementing Handler inheritance in the same
fashion as log4j.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I also find it annoying that I have to use the
log( ) method on a Logger object in order to pass an exception to be logged. Why
is there no implementation such as severe(String msg, Throwable
exception)?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The list could go on ... for example, the way
properties files are used for configuration is very annoying
....</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>For a good summary of the issues with the
java.util.logging package, I refer you to <A
href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A>.
I agree with all of the points raised by this article, and would whole heartedly
support including the log4j logging implementation in the JDK!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Sincerely,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Brent Sprecher</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Product Engineer</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Servidium Inc. (</FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2><A
href="http://www.servidium.com">http://www.servidium.com</A>)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>(403) 263-3287</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/CarlBacher.html
Index: CarlBacher.html
===================================================================
<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:32:25 -0500 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Carl Bacher <cbacher@us-rx.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (WinNT; U) <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Accept-Language: en <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To:
java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: 1.4 Java Logging
<BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>After reviewing the jdk 1.4 logging api and discussing it's impact
with</DIV>
<DIV>others, I'd like to suggest that you consider the Apache Group's
log4j</DIV>
<DIV>api architecture as a possible alternative to be included in the 1.4</DIV>
<DIV>release.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Log4j has been tested rigorously, has been enhanced greatly on a very</DIV>
<DIV>tight feedback loop, and is built upon a solid architecture. Log4j
also</DIV>
<DIV>stresses memory management and performance issues and has a
tremendous</DIV>
<DIV>array of output destination options.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I will continue to use log4j regardless. I'd just hate to see Sun
pass</DIV>
<DIV>up the opportunity to utilize a superior piece of open-source
software.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Thank you for your ear,</DIV>
<DIV>Carl Bacher</DIV>
<DIV>Sr. Java Developer, Wellinx</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/ChristopherTaylor.html
Index: ChristopherTaylor.html
===================================================================
<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: "Christopher Taylor"
<cstaylor@java-internals.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To:
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
"Ceki G�lc�xj/A==" <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: Please adopt Log4J as the replacement for JSR47
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:45:51 -0700
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express
6.00.2462.0000 <BR></SPAN><BR><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.2462.0" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I would strongly suggest that Sun refrain from
offering yet another logging framework. Log4J has the mindshare, the
development community, and the flexibility that JSR47 currently does not.
Since Sun has already moved Servlet and JSP development over to the Jakarta
project, why not let Jakarta handle the logging as well?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Christopher Taylor</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Log4J developer</FONT> </DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/CourtDemas.html
Index: CourtDemas.html
===================================================================
<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 17:23:41 -0700 (PDT) <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Court Demas <courtdemas@yahoo.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Reply-To: court@acm.org <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: please adopt log4j in jdk1.4 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>I urge you to consider this document: </DIV>
<DIV><A href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A></DIV><BR>
<DIV>It is a critique of the JSR47 logging system, to be included in the
JDK</DIV>
<DIV>1.4. I agree with the author that the log4j api should be
adopted</DIV>
<DIV>instead.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>court</DIV><BR><BR>
<DIV>__________________________________________________</DIV>
<DIV>Do You Yahoo!?</DIV>
<DIV>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 </DIV>
<DIV>a year! <A href="http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/</A></DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/DanTanner.html
Index: DanTanner.html
===================================================================
<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Dan Tanner <dtanner@is.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com '"
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: input <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed,
13 Jun 2001 10:27:06 -0500 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer:
Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>My background is:</DIV>
<DIV>I currently use log4j. I don't have any personal attachments to
it. There</DIV>
<DIV>is room for improvement for it, but it has become a well-honed tool
for</DIV>
<DIV>logging through heavy use and development, and I hope you remain as open
as</DIV>
<DIV>possible in making the best of the proposed spec and log4j.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I think you need to:</DIV>
<DIV>- Do performance comparisons between your latest implementation and
log4j.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>- Provide a response to Ceki G�lc�'s critique on a point-by-point basis,
and</DIV>
<DIV>make it publicly available for further responses from those currently
using</DIV>
<DIV>some sort of logging tool. </DIV>
<DIV>i.e. Do you agree with each point? If not, why?</DIV><BR><BR>
<DIV>This component will be especially important to Sun's image for supporters
as</DIV>
<DIV>well as competitors. If successful, it will show the immense value of
open</DIV>
<DIV>community involvement in creating the best software. It is a
huge</DIV>
<DIV>opportunity to show that you mean what you say. If unsuccessful,
it'll look</DIV>
<DIV>like the bickering that occurs too often in the linux community.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Therefore, I urge you once again to think carefully and openly to
make</DIV>
<DIV>java.util.logging a utility people are happy to embrace.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Thanks.</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/DavidMaharaj.html
Index: DavidMaharaj.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Originating-IP: [24.19.162.220] <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: "David Maharaj" <admaharaj@msn.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: log4j and jsr 47 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 11:26:32 -0700 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Jun 2001 18:26:32.0766 (UTC)
FILETIME=[5F1F1DE0:01C0F436] <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Hi,</DIV>
<DIV> I have only recently started using a logging api and was thrilled
when I found log4j. It is simple to use and considering the number of us already
using it, well tested. I especially appreciate that it is easily extendable to
my own uses and that it leaves the smallest footprint on my code. It gives me
complete control over extending it and how and where I output my information. I
also am very interested in configuring logging at a particular hierarchy
and not letting configuration at too high a level overwrite some of the
lower level logging that I may be most interested in at a given time.</DIV>
<DIV> Please reconsider shaping jsr47 to log4j. We are a lot of happy
customers and would like to see the jdk1.4 composed of the best apis.</DIV>
<DIV> Thanx for your time,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Dave Maharaj</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Sun Certified Java Programmer</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV><BR clear=all>
<HR>
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at <A
href="http://explorer.msn.com">http://explorer.msn.com</A><BR>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/DavidOwens.html
Index: DavidOwens.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Sender: dowens@synxis.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 07:00:20 -0600 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: David Owens <dowens@synxis.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.16-3 i686)
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Accept-Language: en <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject:
JDK 1.4 logging API <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-scanner: scanned by
Inflex 0.1.5c - (<A href="http://www.inflex.co.za/"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://www.inflex.co.za/</A>) <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>To whom it may concern,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I think it is a great idea to create a common logging API for java. </DIV>
<DIV>Many developers</DIV>
<DIV>have wanted something more flexible than System.out.println() and
less</DIV>
<DIV>difficult</DIV>
<DIV>than writing to output streams explicitly. However, this need
has</DIV>
<DIV>already been </DIV>
<DIV>fulfilled and widely adopted by the development community. The
API</DIV>
<DIV>which accomplished</DIV>
<DIV>this is called Log4J. An attempt at JSR47 would be like reinventing
the</DIV>
<DIV>wheel, and </DIV>
<DIV>would initially lead only to a less mature, and less flexible logging</DIV>
<DIV>package. Not</DIV>
<DIV>to mention all the time wasted creating and testing it. I think
you</DIV>
<DIV>should reconsider</DIV>
<DIV>launching such a project and instead consider packaging Log4J with
the</DIV>
<DIV>JDK.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Thank you for your time and consideration,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>David Owens</DIV>
<DIV>Software Engineer</DIV><BR>
<DIV><A href="file://c:\program%20files\qualcomm\eudora\attach\dowens1.vcf"
EUDORA="ATTACHMENT"
file="file://c:\program%20files\qualcomm\eudora\attach\dowens1.vcf"><IMG
alt="c:\program files\qualcomm\eudora\attach\dowens1.vcf"
src="file://c:\program files\qualcomm\eudora\icons\31d070.jpg"> dowens1.vcf
</A></DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/EllisTeer.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 18:35:16 -0700 (PDT) <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Ellis Teer <e_teer@yahoo.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: JSR47 vs. log4j <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>To whom it may concern,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I feel that the differences between log4j and the JSR47 API outlined at
the</DIV>
<DIV>following URL are significant.</DIV><BR>
<DIV><A href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A></DIV><BR>
<DIV>I also feel, that rather than reinventing the wheel the JSR47 group
should</DIV>
<DIV>incorporate the log4j API rather than recreating it. The standards
put forth</DIV>
<DIV>by the JSR group will eventually replace any similarly functioning external
API</DIV>
<DIV>due to its incorporation into the JDK. For the number of people who
already</DIV>
<DIV>use log4j, such as myself, it feels that Sun by way of including this new
API</DIV>
<DIV>in the JDK is forcing users of log4j to switch. I understand that
there are</DIV>
<DIV>licensing issues but I suspect Ceki would be accommodating in this
regard.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>In addition, by incorporating such projects into the API rather than
recreating</DIV>
<DIV>them from scratch I believe Sun will promote more projects like these to
move</DIV>
<DIV>forward rather than possibly dissuading programmers from creating new API's
for</DIV>
<DIV>fear that their work will become useless by Sun's recreation of their
features</DIV>
<DIV>in the next JDK.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I point to the success of Tomcat as an example.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Sincerely,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>-Ellis Teer</DIV><BR>
<DIV>__________________________________________________</DIV>
<DIV>Do You Yahoo!?</DIV>
<DIV>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 </DIV>
<DIV>a year! <A href="http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/</A></DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/EndreStolsvik.html
Index: EndreStolsvik.html
===================================================================
<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Authentication-Warning: jeeves.stud.ntnu.no: endrs owned
process doing -bs <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001
12:26:26 +0200 (MET DST) <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Endre
St�lsvik <Endre@Stolsvik.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-X-Sender: <endrs@jeeves.stud.ntnu.no>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: <java-logging-input@eng.sun.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: Logging API - JSR47
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS perl-10
<BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>There has been lots of critique on the logging API being defined by</DIV>
<DIV>the JSR47 expert group.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Log4j is a Open Source logging package that has been around for
several</DIV>
<DIV>years and have had _lots_ of time to develop. It quite recently became
an</DIV>
<DIV>Apache project, and has after this gotten even more downloads, usage
and</DIV>
<DIV>hence improvements.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I urge the expert group to at least take into serious consideration
all</DIV>
<DIV>the inputs it has gotten from various projects, while the standard
still</DIV>
<DIV>is in the "public-review stage".</DIV>
<DIV> Ceki G�lc� is the "main man" for the log4j project, and have written
a</DIV>
<DIV>condensed "report" of what he feels is the "worst" design choices
that</DIV>
<DIV>have been done in the JSR47.</DIV>
<DIV> Read: <A
href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A></DIV><BR>
<DIV>I cannot understand why the JSR47 cannot _base_ their work on this
_widely</DIV>
<DIV>used_ logging package that's already been out in the fields for
years.</DIV>
<DIV>Several other logging packages' teams have complained about the
JSR47's</DIV>
<DIV>API. If Sun actually mean that their JSR process is _somewhat_ open,
it</DIV>
<DIV>would be rather idiotic to not take all this feedback into
consideration.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Thank you for your time.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>-- </DIV>
<DIV>Mvh,</DIV>
<DIV>Endre</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/EoinFlood.html
Index: EoinFlood.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 14:31:28 +0100 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Eoin Flood <eoin.flood@orbiscom.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (WinNT; U)
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Accept-Language: en <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject:
Log4J vs JSR47 <BR></SPAN><BR><BR>
<DIV>As a long time 'user' of the log4j framework I would like to add my voice
in</DIV>
<DIV>support of log4j over JSR47.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>log4j is now an extremly widely used, stable and extensible framework</DIV>
<DIV>which has been tried, tested and trusted by thousands of developers</DIV>
<DIV>around the world.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I would ask you to seriously consider the points which Ceki makes in</DIV>
<DIV><A href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A></DIV><BR>
<DIV>Thanks</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Eoin Flood</DIV><BR><BR><BR>
<DIV>**********************************************************************</DIV>
<DIV>The information contained in this message is confidential and </DIV>
<DIV>is intended for the addressee(s) only. If you have received </DIV>
<DIV>this message in error or there are any problems please notify </DIV>
<DIV>the originator immediately. The unauthorised use, disclosure, </DIV>
<DIV>copying or alteration of this message is strictly forbidden. This</DIV>
<DIV>message and any attachments have been scanned for viruses.</DIV>
<DIV>Orbiscom Ltd. will not be liable for direct, special, indirect or </DIV>
<DIV>consequential damages arising from alteration of the contents </DIV>
<DIV>of this message by a third party or as a result of any virus being</DIV>
<DIV>passed on.</DIV><BR><BR>
<DIV><A href="http://www.orbiscom.com/"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">www.Orbiscom.com</A></DIV>
<DIV>**************************************</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/GuyLichtman.html
Index: GuyLichtman.html
===================================================================
<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Guy Lichtman <lichtman@omnisky.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com'"
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
'Ceki G?lc?' <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject:
please consider adopting log4j <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13
Jun 2001 09:46:54 +0200 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Internet
Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) <BR></SPAN><BR><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<META content="MSHTML 5.50.4613.1700" name=GENERATOR>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=381183207-13062001>Hi,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=381183207-13062001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=381183207-13062001><FONT size=2><FONT face=Arial>I think log4j
is a widely used logging package. My company is currently using this
package and we plan to keep using it in the future. I reviewed the java 1.4
logging package and I can say that log4j offers us added functionality that we
need and use (automatically generate email, </FONT><FONT face=Arial>JMS
channels). I hope that you will reconsider this decision or at least come out
with a package that log4j can be easily implemented into (I think this
requires some modification as stated by </FONT><FONT face=Arial>Ceki G�lc� in
</FONT></FONT><A href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html"><FONT
color=#000000 face=Arial
size=2>http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</FONT></A><FONT
face=Arial size=2> ).</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV></SPAN><SPAN class=381183207-13062001><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hope you
will reconsider,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Guy Lichtman</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>OmniSky Israel</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/HenrikFredholm.html
Index: HenrikFredholm.html
===================================================================
<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: henrik.fredholm@telenor.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject:
Please adopt log4j as the logging API shiped with JDK 1.4 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 13:17:49 +0200 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Hi,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Could you please adopt log4j as the logging API shiped with JDK 1.4. This
is</DIV>
<DIV>an excelent API that I feel is superior to JSR47 and addresses the needs
we</DIV>
<DIV>have for loging. It even works with existing JDKs. We have adopted it
as</DIV>
<DIV>standard for all J2EE BEA WebLogic based projects in our
organization.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Thanks </DIV>
<DIV>Henrik Fredholm</DIV>
<DIV>J2EE Coordinator/Architect for</DIV>
<DIV>Telenor Mobil</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/HenrikLundahl.html
Index: HenrikLundahl.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: henrik.lundahl@jayway.se (Henrik Lundahl)
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: <java-logging-input@eng.sun.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: JSR 47 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date:
Wed, 13 Jun 2001 11:00:39 +0200 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer:
Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 <BR></SPAN><BR><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<META content="MSHTML 5.50.4611.1300" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Would you please reconsider using the JSR47 API as
the logging toolkit in JDK 1.4. There is already a well tested and widely used
logging API for Java, namely Log4j from jakarta <A
href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j</A>.
Consider incorporating this into JDK 1.4 instead!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I've used Log4j in my master thesis project and I
haven't had any problems with it.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Regards, Henrik Lundahl, Jayway AB,
Sweden.</FONT></DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/HenryLi.html
Index: HenryLi.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To:
java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release
5.0.5 September 22, 2000 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>From:
Henry.Li@expeditors.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun
2001 11:42:12 -0700 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-MIMETrack: Serialize
by Router on notes-smtp01.chq.ei/Servers/Expeditors(Release 5.0.6a
<BR> |January 17, 2001) at 06/13/2001 11:46:41 AM <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>I don't know how many companies are using Log4J. I extended the log4j
for</DIV>
<DIV>our company and the extension is now used as one of our companies</DIV>
<DIV>enterprise components. Log4J is so easy to use, easy to extend and easy
to</DIV>
<DIV>configure. I don't see any reason that sun should recreate a logging
API</DIV>
<DIV>which does the exact same thing.</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/JamesProkash.html
Index: JamesProkash.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: "Prokash, Jim" <JProkash@TICENTERPRISES.COM>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com'"
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
"'cgu@qos.ch'" <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject:
Adopt log4j as the logging API <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13
Jun 2001 10:10:03 -0400 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Internet
Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>To whom it may concern:</DIV><BR>
<DIV> I am writing to ask you to adopt log4j as the logging API shipped
with</DIV>
<DIV>JDK1.4. I have successfully, and easily, used the log4j package in
several</DIV>
<DIV>projects. Log4j was a Javaworld Editors' Choice Finalist for
2001,</DIV>
<DIV>indicating to me that I am not the only satisfied user of log4j.
The</DIV>
<DIV>critique, <A href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A> ,
written by</DIV>
<DIV>log4j's author highlights several advantages of log4j over the
current</DIV>
<DIV>recommendation. Although seemingly similar, I am concerned about
having to</DIV>
<DIV>learn another logging API. Why reinvent the "logging" wheel when
a</DIV>
<DIV>comprehensive solution already exists?</DIV><BR>
<DIV> Thank you for your time and consideration of this issue.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Sincerely,</DIV>
<DIV>James Prokash</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/JasonHeirtzler.html
Index: JasonHeirtzler.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:33:17 -0700 (PDT) <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Jason Heirtzler <jheirtzler@yahoo.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: JSR47 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Hello,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I am concerned about the possability that JSR47</DIV>
<DIV>may be included in JDK 1.4. If this happens, it</DIV>
<DIV>will become the defacto standard and many people</DIV>
<DIV>will have no choice but pick JSR47 over log4j,</DIV>
<DIV>no matter what the technical merits may be of</DIV>
<DIV>one vs the other.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>With log4j we have a very workable solution that</DIV>
<DIV>the community enjoys, that supports all of us</DIV>
<DIV>that are using JDK 1.x, JDK 1.2, and JDK 1.3. log4j</DIV>
<DIV>is very well debugged, well optimized, and enjoys</DIV>
<DIV>much support from the greater java community.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I would ask you to consider everyone's best</DIV>
<DIV>interest and favor this existing package and</DIV>
<DIV>not reinvent the wheel.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I sincerely hope we can accomplish this and</DIV>
<DIV>build on top of the community's hard work to</DIV>
<DIV>make java development the best it can be.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Best regards,</DIV><BR><BR>
<DIV>__________________________________________________</DIV>
<DIV>Do You Yahoo!?</DIV>
<DIV>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 </DIV>
<DIV>a year! <A href="http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/</A></DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/JasonKitcat.html
Index: JasonKitcat.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Sender: fproject@mail.kia.net <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 18:19:48 +0100 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Jason Kitcat <jeep@free-project.org>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: log4j v. JSR47 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Hello,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>While a happy Java user for many years it seems incredible that you have
ignored all the work and community support behind log4j (let alone it's
technical superiority) to create a new product.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Of particular concern to us at the FREE e-democracy project is that
GNU.FREE is backwards compatible with as many version of the JVM as possible.
The fact that log4j supports 1.1 upwards and JSR47 will only work with 1.4
upwards indicates that we never be able to consider your propose
alternative.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Please withdraw it and join the community, I'm sure there's lots you could
contribute to the log4j team.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>All the best,</DIV>
<DIV>Jason</DIV><BR>
<DIV>-- </DIV>
<DIV> The FREE
e-democracy project</DIV>
<DIV>----------------------------------------</DIV>
<DIV> <A
href="http://www.free-project.org/"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://www.free-project.org</A></DIV>
<DIV>----------------------------------------</DIV>
<DIV> secure, private and reliable Free Software</DIV><BR>
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: "Loda, Joe" <Joe.Loda@mpct.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com'"
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
"'cgu@qos.ch'" <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject:
JSR47 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:34:15 -0500
<BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>I feel that the feature set of log4j is stronger than JSR47, and would
urge</DIV>
<DIV>you to consider log4j as the JDK 1.4 logging utility.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>---</DIV>
<DIV>Joe Loda, mpct Solutions Corporation, Chicago</DIV>
<DIV>joe.loda@mpct.com</DIV>
No revision
No revision
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: "John Munsch" <jmunsch@pdxinc.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: <java-logging-input@eng.sun.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: I'm not a big letter writer, but... <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 11:04:42 -0500 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Importance: Normal <BR></SPAN><BR>
<META content=Word.Document name=ProgId>
<META content="Microsoft Word 10" name=Generator>
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href="cid:filelist.xml@01C0F3F8.A56FCB20" rel=File-List>
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<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">I would be hard pressed to find any
logging system better than the one in Log4J. I used it at a previous employer
and just managed <I><SPAN style="FONT-STYLE: italic">today</SPAN></I> to
convince my new employer that it should replace a proprietary system they paid
to have built that wasn�t serving them well.<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><O:P> </O:P></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Putting Log4J into JDK1.4 is a
decision that I have a hard time believing anyone would ever regret. It is truly
easy to use, has a lot of flexibility, and an official Sun stamp of approval
along with their careful improvements to the code would only benefit end users
like me. Any system that doesn�t offer as much functionality, flexibility and
ease of use as Log4J is, I think, an unfortunate
choice.<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><O:P> </O:P></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">While I cannot speak to all the
points raised in a recent comparison of Log4J to JSR47 I can speak to two in
particular:<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal
style="MARGIN-LEFT: 20.9pt; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list 20.9pt"><FONT
face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; mso-fareast-font-family: Arial"><SPAN
style="mso-list: Ignore">-<FONT face="Times New Roman" size=1><SPAN
style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'">
</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Functionality: the wide set of <SPAN
class=SpellE>appenders</SPAN> that come standard with Log4J has been a big
selling <SPAN class=GramE>point</SPAN> everywhere I�ve used it. Even if we do
not use all of the <SPAN class=SpellE>appenders</SPAN>, it�s not hard to imagine
customers of ours who will be interested in using some of the additional ones
provided (i.e. NT event logging or Unix <SPAN
class=SpellE>Syslog</SPAN>).<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal
style="MARGIN-LEFT: 20.9pt; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1; tab-stops: list 20.9pt"><FONT
face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; mso-fareast-font-family: Arial"><SPAN
style="mso-list: Ignore">-<FONT face="Times New Roman" size=1><SPAN
style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'">
</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Levels: I can vouch for having
arguments about how to use the five simple levels in Log4J between myself and
just one other programmer (not loud shouting type arguments, but serious
disagreements over when each should be used). Adding additional levels was the
last thing on our minds and I believe really unneeded for most projects. I don�t
think ALL, OFF, FINE, FINER and FINEST really add anything to the party, BUT, if
they were deemed important they could easily be added to the existing Log4J
system when it was folded into the JDK1.4.<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><O:P> </O:P></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Thanks,<O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">John <SPAN
class=SpellE>Munsch</SPAN><O:P></O:P></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><O:P> </O:P></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Note: I am not acting in any
official capacity for my employer, but rather just giving my two cents as a Java
developer with experience using an excellent API.</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: John Volkar <jvolkar@etransport.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: JSR47 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed,
13 Jun 2001 07:19:27 -0400 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer:
Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>After a review of the beta JDK 1.4, and the logging API, we have
decided</DIV>
<DIV>that it is unfortunate that the logging mechanism is not pluggable.
In our</DIV>
<DIV>systems we use log4j in a very specific and customized fashion, the
JSR47</DIV>
<DIV>logging mechanism is wholly unsuited to our needs. That's fine, but
we'd</DIV>
<DIV>really like to use the Sun provided api (because of client perceptions,
no</DIV>
<DIV>*real* reason otherwise) and plug-in our own implementation (which would
be</DIV>
<DIV>our special configuration of Log4j).</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Please, before it's too late, change JSR47 to either:</DIV>
<DIV><X-TAB> </X-TAB>A) use Log4j
directly</DIV>
<DIV>or:<X-TAB> </X-TAB>B) clearly define an API
via an interface, and make the</DIV>
<DIV>implementation pluggable.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Regards</DIV><BR>
<DIV>John Volkar</DIV>
<DIV>Senior Software Engineer II</DIV>
<DIV>Descartes Systems Group (DSGX)</DIV>
<DIV>Pittsburgh PA</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/JonStevens.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/9.0.1.3108 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 16:57:49 -0700 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: Log4J Vote <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>From:
Jon Stevens <jon@latchkey.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To:
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
<jcp@apache.org>, Ceki G�lc�/A== <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Dear Members of JSR47:</DIV><BR>
<DIV>This is my vote to drop whatever you have for JDK1.4 and use Log4J as
the</DIV>
<DIV>standard instead. Using an open source implementation of a Logging system
is</DIV>
<DIV>highly preferable to using something that has been defined behind the
walls</DIV>
<DIV>of the JCP because Log4J has been able to take input from more people
over</DIV>
<DIV>time and this has helped create a more useful product. I also believe
Ceki</DIV>
<DIV>is a wizard when it comes to designing Logging systems.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>His Critique on his website is also well written and shows many of
the</DIV>
<DIV>problems with JSR47. Even if you do make the modifications that he
suggests,</DIV>
<DIV>it would be a duplication of what is already available and that seems
quite</DIV>
<DIV>unnecessary to have two implementations of the exact same thing.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>thanks,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>-jon stevens</DIV>
<DIV>Member: JSR-053, JSR-107</DIV>
<DIV>Member: Apache Software Foundation</DIV>
<DIV>Co-Founder: Jakarta Apache Project</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/KnutErikBallestad.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Reply-To: <knut.erik.ballestad@jarepta.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>From: "Knut Erik Ballestad"
<knut.erik.ballestad@jarepta.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To:
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
<cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: Logging API.
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 12:53:18 +0200
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build
9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Importance: High
<BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Would you PLEASE consider using the open-source Log4J API instead of</DIV>
<DIV>introducing yet another</DIV>
<DIV>API in Java. Log4J has existed a long time already, and we have been
using</DIV>
<DIV>it without any</DIV>
<DIV>problems at all in many large production-level application for the last
12</DIV>
<DIV>months.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>After what I have been able figure out the API of JSR47 is similar to
Log4J,</DIV>
<DIV>but less powerful and a lot less 'tried and tested'. It also has a (in
my</DIV>
<DIV>view) bad design flaw, since it can throw exceptions.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Hope you will at least consider using Log4J as the 'standard' in
future</DIV>
<DIV>JDK's instead.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>________________________________________________</DIV>
<DIV>Knut Erik Ballestad</DIV>
<DIV>jobb: 9082 6078
knut.erik.ballestad@jarepta.com</DIV>
<DIV>hjem: 2216 2034 knut.erik@ballestad.com</DIV>
<DIV>________________________________________________</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/MichaelMoser.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Reply-To: <michael.moser@freesurf.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: "Michael Moser" <mmo@zurich.ibm.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: <java-logging-input@eng.sun.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: "Ceki G�lc�" <cgu@qos.ch>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:57:27 +0200
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build
9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Importance: Normal
<BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Hello,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I have been using log4j for more than a year now and think its well
tested</DIV>
<DIV>and serves its purpose splendidly.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Comparing log4j and the upcoming JDK 1.4 logging API I consider log4j</DIV>
<DIV>superior and would urge you to adopt it as your new standard logging API.
I</DIV>
<DIV>don't see any point in re-inventing (and thereby changing for worse)
an</DIV>
<DIV>already excellent piece of work.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>With kind regards,</DIV>
<DIV>Michael Moser</DIV><BR>
<DIV>-------------</DIV>
<DIV>Dr. Michael Moser Telephone: +41-(0)1 362 0743
(P)</DIV>
<DIV>Frohburgstr.
19
+41-(0)1 724 8539 (B)</DIV>
<DIV>CH-8006
Z�rich
+41-(0)76 420 8539 (M)</DIV>
<DIV>Switzerland
Internet : michael.moser@freesurf.ch</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/MichaelStacey.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Sender: michael.stacey@mail.lexi.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 08:25:42 -0400
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Michael Stacey
<michael@lexi.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: JSR47:
logging api <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-MDRemoteIP: 172.16.3.15 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Return-Path: michael@lexi.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Sirs:</DIV><BR>
<DIV> After attending JavaOne and
reviewing the proposed logging API described in</DIV>
<DIV>JSR 47, I wish to register a vote for using the log4j api instead.
Various performance and flexibility features of log4j seem superior to those
proposed in</DIV>
<DIV>JSR 47.</DIV><BR>
<DIV> In particular, we make heavy use
of the ability of log4j to automatically</DIV>
<DIV>generate email in particular cases. With the proposed api in JSR 47,
we would need</DIV>
<DIV>to rewrite a handler to accomplish the task we are already using in
log4j.</DIV><BR><BR><BR><BR>
<DIV>------------------</DIV>
<DIV>Michael Stacey</DIV>
<DIV>Systems Analyst</DIV>
<DIV>Lexi-Comp, Inc.</DIV>
<DIV>1100 Terex Rd</DIV>
<DIV>Hudson OH 44236</DIV>
<DIV>330 650-6506</DIV><BR><BR><BR>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/NelsonMinar.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 17:36:47 -0700 (PDT) <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: nelson@monkey.org (Nelson Minar) <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: java-logging-input@eng.sun.com <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: Logging API comments: line numbers, conditional
compilation, log4j <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Hello there, and thank you so much for your work on JSR47! I'm
looking</DIV>
<DIV>forward to having a logging facility built in to J2SE. I've been a</DIV>
<DIV>user of log4j in commerical projects for almost two years now, and</DIV>
<DIV>have come to depend on the tool. It will be good to have something</DIV>
<DIV>similar in Java.</DIV><BR><BR>
<DIV>Three comments on the proposal, based on looking at the 1.4 API:</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I was disappointed to see no VM level support for logging. I want to</DIV>
<DIV>be able to print out file and line numbers in my log messages. You
can</DIV>
<DIV>do this with log4j, but it's done via runtime hack of parsing the</DIV>
<DIV>string representation of a Throwable. The VM could help with this, if</DIV>
<DIV>it were in the 1.4 standard. The JSR47 alternative (passing in</DIV>
<DIV>sourceClass and sourceMethod as strings to Logger) is not very</DIV>
<DIV>helpful, I can't imagine code authors writing and maintaining
those.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I was also disappointed to see no compiler level support for
compiling</DIV>
<DIV>out logging entirely. Everyone I know has some variant of a static</DIV>
<DIV>final boolean that they switch on. It's important when shipping</DIV>
<DIV>proprietary code - it can be dangerous to leave the logging strings</DIV>
<DIV>in. But Java has a long history of no conditional compilation, so I</DIV>
<DIV>guess that's why there is no support for it.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>But my main comment is that I am frankly mystified as to why JSR47</DIV>
<DIV>does not more closely resemble log4j, or why log4j was not just</DIV>
<DIV>adopted wholesale. Log4j is the defacto standard logging API, and has</DIV>
<DIV>had years of development and use. It has several advanced features</DIV>
<DIV>that are missing from JSR47. Ceki has written up a detailed review</DIV>
<DIV>that I mostly agree with:</DIV>
<DIV> <A href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A></DIV>
<DIV>For what it's worth, the big omissions in JSR47 to me are some sort
of</DIV>
<DIV>equivalent to PatternLayout, and the limited handler inheritance</DIV>
<DIV>properties of JSR47.</DIV><BR><BR>
<DIV>Frankly, at this point I don't see any reason to use JSR47 instead of</DIV>
<DIV>log4j, except that it will ship in Java 1.4 platforms. I see lots of</DIV>
<DIV>reasons log4j is better. Is it too late to bring the Java 1.4 API</DIV>
<DIV>closer to log4j?</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Thank you</DIV>
<DIV> Nelson</DIV><BR>
<DIV>
nelson@monkey.org</DIV>
<DIV>. .
. . . . . . <A
href="http://www.media.mit.edu/~nelson/"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://www.media.mit.edu/~nelson/</A></DIV>
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Paul Grinchenko <PaulG@DataChannel.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com'"
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
"'cgu@qos.ch'" <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject:
JSR47 - Critique <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001
17:15:44 -0700 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Internet Mail
Service (5.5.2653.19) <BR></SPAN><BR><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
<META content="MS Exchange Server version 5.5.2653.12" name=Generator>
<P><FONT size=2>I completely agree with the written below and consider myself as
an experienced Log4J user.</FONT> </P>
<P><FONT size=2> <A
href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html"
target=_blank>http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A></FONT> </P>
<P><FONT size=2>It will be really difficult to produce something more advanced
or flexible than Log4J right now. </FONT><BR><FONT size=2>At this situation I
don't see the reason for reinventing the wheel again. That was my point.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT size=2>Thanks for listening.</FONT> </P>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/RalfHaug.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Ralf Haug <Ralf.Haug@thinkXML.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com'"
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
"'cgu@qos.ch'" <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject:
JSR47 - Log4J <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001
10:16:05 -0400 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Internet Mail
Service (5.5.2650.21) <BR></SPAN><BR><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<META content="MSHTML 5.50.4134.600" name=GENERATOR>
<DIV><SPAN class=682391614-13062001><FONT face=Arial size=2>I'd like to support
adoption of Log4J as the official JDK 1.4 logging standard for the reasons
stated in <A
href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A> .
In addition, Log4J has a very successful track record, so unless there are good
reasons against it, it should be adopted.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=682391614-13062001><FONT face=Arial
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=682391614-13062001><FONT face=Arial size=2>Ralf
Haug</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=682391614-13062001><FONT face=Arial
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=682391614-13062001><FONT face=Arial size=2>Chief Software
Architect, thinkXML</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/RichardWilliams.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Richard Williams <richard.williams@cst-hsv.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'cgu@qos.ch'" <cgu@qos.ch>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: FW: JSR-47 Protest <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 14:26:55 -0500 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19)
<BR></SPAN><BR><BR><BR>
<DIV>> -----Original Message-----</DIV>
<DIV>> From:
<X-TAB> </X-TAB>Richard
Williams </DIV>
<DIV>> Sent:<X-TAB> </X-TAB>Wednesday, June 13, 2001 2:26 PM</DIV>
<DIV>>
To:<X-TAB> </X-TAB>'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com'</DIV>
<DIV>> Subject:<X-TAB> </X-TAB>JSR-47
Protest</DIV>
<DIV>> </DIV>
<DIV>> Please bring the JSR-47 implementation inline with the Apache
Log4J</DIV>
<DIV>> logging implementation. Log4J has become the defacto standard within
our</DIV>
<DIV>> organization and we would like to see it used as the Java standard.
The</DIV>
<DIV>> syslog support in Log4J is mission critical to our operation.</DIV>
<DIV>> </DIV>
<DIV>> Thanks,</DIV>
<DIV>> </DIV>
<DIV>> Richard Williams</DIV>
<DIV>> CTO</DIV>
<DIV>> Computer Systems Technology, Inc.</DIV>
<DIV>> Huntsville, AL</DIV>
<DIV>> Voice: 256-890-3076</DIV>
<DIV>> Email: rwilliam@cst-hsv.com</DIV>
<DIV>> </DIV>
<DIV>> </DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/RobertMahoney.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 20:39:46 -0400 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: rmahoney@ieaccess.net (Robert Mahoney) <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Reply-To: Robert Mahoney <rmahoney@ieaccess.net>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: JSR47 vs Log4j <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: The Polarbar Mailer; version=1.20dev; build=138
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer-Platform: Windows NT;
architecture=x86; version=4.0 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer-Java-VM: IBM Corporation; version=JDK 1.1.8 IBM
build n118p-20000915 (JIT ibmjitc V3.5-IBMJDK1.1-20000915); compiler=ibmjitc
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: undisclosed-recipients:; <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV> I would like to register my opposition to using JSR47 as the
official Java</DIV>
<DIV>logging API. I've used Log4j ( <A
href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/)"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/)</A> and find it</DIV>
<DIV>a much better and robust API.</DIV><BR>
<DIV> Please adopt Log4j as the official logging API for
java.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Thank you,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Robert Mahoney</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/RonJacobs.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Ron Jacobs <rjacobs@gforce.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com'"
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
"'cgu@qos.ch'" <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: A
Plea for LOG4J Consideration (RE: JSR47 Critique) <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 10:21:10 -0700 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>I agree with many others that, in most respects, LOG4J is a superior
API</DIV>
<DIV>and implementation for logging events within Java code. I have been
using</DIV>
<DIV>the API since last Summer and have been impressed with its progress
since</DIV>
<DIV>that time. If you have not given LOG4J a good look in the last year,</DIV>
<DIV>please look again!</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Let me be clear: My plea primarily is that the features and
capabilities</DIV>
<DIV>already available with LOG4J must be included within JSR-47 in order
for</DIV>
<DIV>me to be able to adopt JSDK 1.4 logging. A secondary issue for me is
API</DIV>
<DIV>compatibility. I have segregated logging within its own layer and so
if</DIV>
<DIV>I have to adapt for a new API I am well prepared. Again, my primary
plea</DIV>
<DIV>is that features, extensibility, and performance not be
sacrificed.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Thanks, Ron</DIV><BR><BR>
<DIV>R. M. Jacobs</DIV>
<DIV>voice: 408-865-9410</DIV>
<DIV><A href="mailto:rjacobs@gforce.com"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">mailto:rjacobs@gforce.com</A></DIV><BR>
<DIV>gForce </DIV>
<DIV>Enterprise eLearning Solutions</DIV>
<DIV>
Get there faster.</DIV><BR>
<DIV><A href="http://www.gforce.com/"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://www.gforce.com</A></DIV><BR>
<DIV>-----Original Message-----</DIV>
<DIV>From: Ceki G�lc� [<A href="mailto:cgu@qos.ch"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">mailto:cgu@qos.ch</A>]</DIV>
<DIV>Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 4:38 PM</DIV>
<DIV>To: LOG4J Users Mailing List</DIV>
<DIV>Cc: log4j-dev@jakarta.apache.org; log4j-announce@log4j.org;</DIV>
<DIV>general@jakarta.apache.org</DIV>
<DIV>Subject: JSR47 Critique</DIV><BR><BR><BR>
<DIV>Greetings,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Here is a written critique of JSR47, the logging API shipped with </DIV>
<DIV>JDK 1.4:</DIV><BR>
<DIV> <A href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html"
EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html</A></DIV><BR>
<DIV>If you agree with its contents, then you are encouraged to send a</DIV>
<DIV>personalized request to</DIV><BR>
<DIV> java-logging-input@eng.sun.com</DIV><BR>
<DIV>asking them to adopt log4j as the logging API shipped with JDK</DIV>
<DIV>1.4. Please cc: me if and when you choose do so. Thank you in
advance.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>--</DIV>
<DIV>Ceki G�lc�</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/StacyCurl.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Stacy Curl <stacy.curl@xtempus.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com'"
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
"'cgu@qos.ch'" <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject:
Preference for Log4J over JSR47 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed,
13 Jun 2001 13:33:13 +0100 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer:
Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) <BR></SPAN><BR><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<META content="MSHTML 5.00.2920.0" name=GENERATOR>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN class=324163011-13062001>I would like to say
that I find that the Log4J project to be superior to JSR47 on many grounds, most
of which are succintly set forth in <FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=324163011-13062001><A
href="http://jakarta.apache.org/log4j/docs/critique.html">Ceki
G�lc�'s</A> </SPAN></FONT></SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=324163011-13062001>critique of JSR47.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=324163011-13062001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN class=324163011-13062001>I found the
presences of logging levels like FINE, FINEST to be quite meaningless across an
entire API; but possibly meaningful withing a single company (a small company),
however a much better alternative is to just have that company define their own
logging levels. I was hoping that JSR47 would draw a line in the Java sands, and
say: From now on you can integrate logging of 3rd party products into your own
logging systems, but if 3rdparty products actually use FINE / FINEST, etc, they
are highly likely to view the meaning as being different; so how can I now
integrate ?</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=324163011-13062001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN class=324163011-13062001>I'm also somewhat
disturbed by the way in which JSR47 lacks an SPI. I've quite liked the way in
which other areas of software have been commoditized by Javasoft; I felt that
was very statesmans-like, it's also generates so-called best-of-breed
implementations. JSR47 however does not commoditize the market, but actually
punishes the best logging product for Java there is: log4j, this is, in my
opinion, a foolish step to make. You may find that not everyone will appreciate
the reduced functionality that JSR47 offers and stick with log4j. Had you
provided JSR47 with an SPI then it would not have been long before log4j would
have implemented the SPI; and bingo! JSR47 would have gathered support
immediately (much like JAXP has). It's a pity that the main factor in creating
JSR47 has been the Not Invented Here syndrome.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
class=324163011-13062001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN class=324163011-13062001>In summary: I think
that Log4J should be made the standard logging API for Java, and not
JSR47.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<P><B><FONT face=Arial>Stacy Curl</FONT></B> </P>
<P><FONT face="Courier New" size=2><A
href="mailto:Stacy.Curl@xtempus.com">Stacy.Curl@xtempus.com</A><BR><A
href="http://www.xtempus.com/">www.xtempus.com</A> | wap.xtempus.com<BR>Tel +44
(0)20 7665 5999<BR>Fax +44 (0)20 7665 5998</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face="Courier New" size=2>Xtempus Ltd<BR>New London House<BR>172 Drury
Lane<BR>London WC2B 5QR </FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=1><B>This message is for the named person's use only.
It may contain confidential, proprietary or legally privileged
information. No confidentiality or privilege is waived or lost by any
mistransmission. If you receive this message in error, please immediately delete
it and all copies of it from your system, destroy any hard copies of it and
notify the sender. You must not, directly or indirectly, use, disclose,
distribute, print, or copy any part of this message if you are not the intended
recipient. </B></FONT></P>
<DIV> </DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/SteveWingfield.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Steve Wingfield <steve.wingfield@informix.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com'"
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
"'cgu@qos.ch'" <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject:
JSR47 enhancement request <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun
2001 11:32:54 -0500 <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Internet Mail
Service (5.5.2653.19) <BR></SPAN><BR><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
<META content="MS Exchange Server version 5.5.2653.12" name=Generator>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>Dear Sun,</FONT> </P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>I'm very pleased to see that JDK1.4 is going to have
a logging API associated with it. And in particular I think the JSR47
specification has some good ideas behind it. However, I'm concerned that,
in its current form, it contains some shortcomings that will affect its
usability and performance. Namely, </FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>1. Performance -- It seems that setting the log
level of the root logger in JSR47 recursively sets the log level of all
descendant loggers. The projects I've worked on tended to have trees with
a large depth to them, which would result in a performance hit under this
scheme. Allowing descendant loggers to determine their log level as needed
would seem to be more performant.</FONT></P><BR>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>2. Usability -- There are a number of areas I'm
concerned about in terms of usability. The following lists the major
ones:</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>Error Handling -- I believe a logging facility should
be as unobtrusive as possible. In its current form, it looks like JSR47
requires programmers to explicitly catch potential runtime exceptions to avoid a
program crash. In my experience, it's been more useful to have a logging
package mostly suppress errors (perhaps, at minimum, reporting an error to a
standard location like stdout/stderr), rather than having to code around error
handlers. </FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>Setting of Log Levels -- I'm a little concerned about
the fact that setting a parent logger's log level will overwrite all of its
children's log levels. I'm not convinced that it will always be convenient
to first set a parent logger's level prior to setting a child's log level.
But in the JSR47 scheme, if you don't set the log levels in the correct order,
you will unintentionally overwrite a child's log level. I'm afraid that
this will at minimum cause confusion, and at worst be intractable in some cases.
</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>Inheriting Parent Handlers -- It doesn't seem like
this is explicitly possible in JSR47. Global handlers provide some of this
functionality, but they are not as flexible as the idea of true handler
inheritance. The same limitation exists for resource bundles.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>Supporting Multiple Concurrent Handlers -- It doesn't
seem that you can have a logger write to more than one handler at a time.
This capability can be extremely useful at times; for example, in tech
support cases, it's nice to be able to add a socket as a log recipient, in
addition to the usual log file.</FONT></P><BR>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>There are some other areas where I believe
improvements could be made, such as log entry formatting, and a more extensive
list of log handlers, but the preceding are the ones that really concern
me. </FONT></P><BR>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>Currently there exists another java logging package
called log4j, available from <A href="http://jakarta.apache.org"
target=_blank>http://jakarta.apache.org</A>, that addresses these items.
I've been using it on various projects, and have been extremely impressed with
its robustness, flexibility, and ease of use. I'm certainly not your
stereotypical die hard fanatic that, once familiar with a software package, will
never sway from it or try anything new. In fact, I'm eager to learn and
become proficient with any Java standard API's that come out. However, the
issues I mentioned above are, I'm afraid, too weighty to allow me to use the
current form of the JSR47 specification in place of the package I've been
using. I hope that you'll take these comments into consideration and
either adopt log4j as the logging API for JDK1.4, or at least revise the current
specification to handle the above listed items.</FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>Sincerely,</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>Steven
Wingfield</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>steve.wingfield@informix.com</FONT>
</P>
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: "Fenner, Thomas" <T.Fenner@klopotek.de>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com'"
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: WG: [log4j-announce]JSR47 Critique <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 11:21:25 +0200 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Importance: high <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19)
<BR></SPAN><BR><BR>
<DIV>Dear sun,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>please dont invest your energy by inventing the wheel again.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Jakarta's LOG4J-project is already a very well working component of
our</DIV>
<DIV>software and we are very pleased with it.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>So why dont you take this chance to pick up that library into JDK1.4
?</DIV><BR><BR>
<DIV>:) Thomas Fenner (t.fenner@klopotek.de)</DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/TonyDean.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: Tony Dean <Tony.Dean@sas.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>To: "'java-logging-input@eng.sun.com'"
<java-logging-input@eng.sun.com> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc:
"'cgu@qos.ch'" <cgu@qos.ch> <BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject:
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:40:51 -0400
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service
(5.5.2653.19) <BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>Concerning JSR47 public review:</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I definitely feel the importance of circumventing the following JSR47
short-coming with Log4j methodology:</DIV><BR>
<DIV>*<X-TAB> </X-TAB>handler
inheritance from ancestor loggers (categories)</DIV>
<DIV>*<X-TAB> </X-TAB>ability to
configure multiple instances of a handler class (restriction of logging to only
one file at a time is totally unacceptable)</DIV>
<DIV>*<X-TAB> </X-TAB>printf-like
formatting is a big plus in convenience</DIV>
<DIV>*<X-TAB> </X-TAB>configuration via
XML format</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Thank you for your consideration.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Tony Dean</DIV>
<DIV>SAS Institute Inc.</DIV>
<DIV>919.531.6704</DIV>
<DIV>tony.dean@sas.com</DIV><BR>
<DIV>SAS... The Power to Know</DIV>
<DIV><A href="http://www.sas.com/" EUDORA="AUTOURL">http://www.sas.com</A></DIV>
1.1 jakarta-log4j/docs/pub-support/WilliamJaynes.html
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<SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Delivered-To: cgu@qos.ch <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>From: "William Jaynes" <jaynes@umich.edu>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>To: <java-logging-input@eng.sun.com>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Cc: "Ceki G�lc�xj/A==" <cgu@qos.ch>
<BR></SPAN><SPAN class=EUDORAHEADER>Subject: JSR47 vs. log4j <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 07:37:12 -0400 <BR></SPAN><SPAN
class=EUDORAHEADER>X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400
<BR></SPAN><BR>
<DIV>To whom it may concern,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I urge the JSR group to consider adopting the log4j API rather than
the</DIV>
<DIV>JSR47 proposal.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Log4j has been developed over a period of years by a large number of</DIV>
<DIV>experienced developers who use it themselves. It is a product of the</DIV>
<DIV>best practices of the opensource tradition, forged in the fire of
public</DIV>
<DIV>scrutiny, public debate, public development, public contributions,
and</DIV>
<DIV>mass public testing. The quality and thoroughness that comes from such
a</DIV>
<DIV>process can not be approached by any committee, no matter how
brilliant</DIV>
<DIV>or experienced the committee members may be.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>I believe that Sun should defer to Log4j, for the same good reasons
that</DIV>
<DIV>it deferred to Tomcat.</DIV><BR>
<DIV>Respectfully,</DIV><BR>
<DIV>William Jaynes</DIV>
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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>Compilation of requests</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
<p>We thank the individuals listed below for their support in our
effort to convince Sun to adopt log4j as the logging API shipped with
JDK 1.4.
<p>Do not hesitate to contact <a href="cgu@qos.ch">cgu@qos.ch</a> in
case you are uncomfortable seeing your name or the contents of your
request reproduced publicly.
<p><UL>
<li><p><a href="AlexBlewitt.html">AlexBlewitt</a>
<li><p><a href="Frank Baxter.html">Frank Baxter</a>
<li><p><a href="EllisTeer.html">Ellis Teer</a>
<li><p><a href="BrentSprecher.html">Brent Sprecher</a>
<li><p><a href="JasonKitcat.html">Jason Kitcat</a>
<li><p><a href="AndyDePue.html">Andy DePue</a>
<li><p><a href="GuyLichtman.html">Guy Lichtman</a>
<li><p><a href="MichaelMoser.html">Michael Moser</a>
<li><p><a href="JonStevens.html">Jon Stevens</a>
<li><p><a href="ChristopherTaylor.html">Christopher Taylor</a>
<li><p><a href="PaulGrinchenko.html">Paul Grinchenko</a>
<li><p><a href="CourtDemas.html">Court Demas</a>
<li><p><a href="NelsonMinar.html">Nelson Minar</a>
<li><p><a href="RobertMahoney.html">Robert Mahoney</a>
<li><p><a href="HenrikLundahl.html">Henrik Lundahl</a>
<li><p><a href="ThomasFenner.html">Thomas Fenner</a>
<li><p><a href="EndreStolsvik.html">Endre Stolsvik</a>
<li><p><a href="KnutErikBallestad.html">Knut Erik Ballestad</a>
<li><p><a href="JohnVolkar.html">John Volkar </a>
<li><p><a href="HenrikFredholm.html">Henrik Fredholm</a>
<li><p><a href="WilliamJaynes.html">William Jaynes</a>
<li><p><a href="MichaelStacey.html">Michael Stacey</a>
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