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Posted to docs-dev@perl.apache.org by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com> on 2002/03/15 11:03:59 UTC
[ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Fellow mod_perl hackers...
It is with great pleasure that I am able to introduce you to the new
mod_perl logo. So, without further ado, point your web-browsers at:
http://beverley2.digital-word.com/mod_perl/winner/
The winning logo, designed by Michael Demers (mike [at] inteo.com), won
by a very clear majority. Congratulations Mike, and thanks for a great
effort!
The new mod_perl button vote resulted in a tie between two designs:
Juergen Spechts' (the existing button) and new design by Tyler
Rorabaugh. Following a brief discussion with Stas (stas [at]
stason.org), I think it might be a good idea to have several mod_perl
buttons, the idea being that a designer can then choose a button that
doesn't conflict with his/her design.
However, I request your comments on this idea: should we have just one
button (helping to develop a distinct identity for mod_perl) or should
we have several (for choice)? It's up to you...
Thank you to everyone who participated in this project. Kudos to the
designers for their efforts. Thanks to Stas for his input and ideas,
and Eric Cholet for the voting script.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
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Re: [OT][ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Joachim Zobel <nc...@netcologne.de>.
At 17:01 16.03.2002 +0100, you wrote:
>Recently I had a discussion with a Java programmer, who said that
>mod_perl is a try to save the obsolete language Perl. His argument was
>that only Java programmers are searched, especially here in Europe.
Naaah. Visual Basic is dominating enterprise application development. This
is true since the time when all the job offers wanted C++.
Lets get Practical :-)
Joachim
--
"... ein Geschlecht erfinderischer Zwerge, die fuer alles gemietet werden
koennen." - Bertolt Brecht - Leben des Galilei
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Gunther Birznieks <gu...@extropia.com>.
At 10:46 PM 3/15/2002, John Saylor wrote:
>Hi
>
>( 02.03.15 10:03 -0000 ) Jonathan M. Hollin:
> > However, I request your comments on this idea: should we have just one
> > button (helping to develop a distinct identity for mod_perl) or should
> > we have several (for choice)? It's up to you...
>
>TMTOWTDI, of course- multiple buttons!
Those of us who have seen the movie Office Space know these as "Flair". At
least 14 are mandatory! :)
RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: A thought - what about putting the suggestion of an
:: underscore by putting bars underneath the d and p of
:: "modperl"? Just a suggestion to Michael as presumably he is
:: revisting the design for the buttons.
I had a similar idea - a single bar under the "dp" yet keeping the "dp"
together.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
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RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: A thought - what about putting the suggestion of an
:: underscore by putting bars underneath the d and p of
:: "modperl"? Just a suggestion to Michael as presumably he is
:: revisting the design for the buttons.
I had a similar idea - a single bar under the "dp" yet keeping the "dp"
together.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Jay Lawrence <Ja...@Lawrence.Net>.
DR>I really like the new logo, and in fact I voted for it. However, I just
DR>realized that the logo uses "modperl", whereas mod_perl's name is
DR>"mod_perl", with the underscore. Does anyone else see this as a problem?
BM>It's a graphic design so I don't see that it needs to follow the Apache
BM>module naming convention exactly... It's a design -- it doesn't have to
BM>be accurate to the name.
A thought - what about putting the suggestion of an underscore by
putting bars underneath the d and p of "modperl"? Just a suggestion
to Michael as presumably he is revisting the design for the buttons.
J
RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: I agree here. But then, TMTOWTDI is a big part of Perl
:: culture. I suggest a democratic solution: present the logo
:: and the favorite logo-based button as "the" logo and button.
:: Then, also present a page which has some alternate buttons
:: on it, including the two winners of the present contest.
:: Make the page with the official logo and button easy to find
:: so users will see it first.
But an important part of any "product" is its brand. I personally
believe that the logo/button/banner should be uniform throughout, with
one font and one colour scheme. One area where we do have creative
license is with banners - providing that the recognised mod_perl logo
still features within.
:: Since there was a landslide winner I would say there is
:: probably no need for alternate logos although it may be
:: interesting for historical reasons (the Google logo archives
:: do it the right way, in my opinion:
:: http://www.google.com/stickers.html).
The logos at http://beverley2.digital-word.com/mod_perl/ will remain
online "forever" for historical/nostalgic purposes.
:: DR>I really like the
:: new logo, and in fact I voted for it. However, I
:: DR>just realized that the logo uses "modperl", whereas
:: mod_perl's name
:: DR>is "mod_perl", with the underscore. Does anyone else see
:: this as a
:: DR>problem?
::
:: BM>It's a graphic design so I don't see that it needs to follow the
:: BM>Apache module naming convention exactly... It's a design -- it
:: BM>doesn't have to be accurate to the name.
::
:: I agree with both these statements. I think the issue isn't
:: that the design must follow the name, but that users often
:: get confused between the two, and if the design doesn't
:: follow the name, that confusion will certainly be
:: exacerbated. Of course, this is probably not a big problem
:: as long as the conventional term is used in the
:: documentation and website and as long as "modperl" on Google
:: leads to the mod_perl site.
I think the logo should feature an underscore, however it's used. We
are promoting a brand, a product... its name needs to be consistent
wherever it's used - how else will we get pointy-haired bosses to
recognise it?
:: I might also point out that any mod_perl hostnames come out
:: as modperl (since underscores are not allowed in hostnames)
:: and that modperl is often used as a directory name even
:: though underscores ARE allowed in filenames.
I don't think that's relevant at all. People name their files and
directories in whatever way suits them. And hostnames, well that's just
a convention we can do nothing about and, thus, a non-issue.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Andrew Ho <an...@tellme.com>.
Hello,
WK>A single button that matches the logo will be simplier, and more
WK>distinct. Too many choices is making it harder for the newcomers.
I agree here. But then, TMTOWTDI is a big part of Perl culture. I suggest
a democratic solution: present the logo and the favorite logo-based button
as "the" logo and button. Then, also present a page which has some
alternate buttons on it, including the two winners of the present contest.
Make the page with the official logo and button easy to find so users will
see it first.
Since there was a landslide winner I would say there is probably no need
for alternate logos although it may be interesting for historical reasons
(the Google logo archives do it the right way, in my opinion:
http://www.google.com/stickers.html).
DR>I really like the new logo, and in fact I voted for it. However, I just
DR>realized that the logo uses "modperl", whereas mod_perl's name is
DR>"mod_perl", with the underscore. Does anyone else see this as a problem?
BM>It's a graphic design so I don't see that it needs to follow the Apache
BM>module naming convention exactly... It's a design -- it doesn't have to
BM>be accurate to the name.
I agree with both these statements. I think the issue isn't that the
design must follow the name, but that users often get confused between the
two, and if the design doesn't follow the name, that confusion will
certainly be exacerbated. Of course, this is probably not a big problem as
long as the conventional term is used in the documentation and website and
as long as "modperl" on Google leads to the mod_perl site.
I might also point out that any mod_perl hostnames come out as modperl
(since underscores are not allowed in hostnames) and that modperl is often
used as a directory name even though underscores ARE allowed in filenames.
Humbly,
Andrew
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Andrew Ho http://www.tellme.com/ andrew@tellme.com
Engineer info@tellme.com Voice 650-930-9062
Tellme Networks, Inc. 1-800-555-TELL Fax 650-930-9101
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Wim Kerkhoff <wi...@merilus.com>.
"Jonathan M. Hollin" wrote:
>
> Fellow mod_perl hackers...
>
> It is with great pleasure that I am able to introduce you to the new
> mod_perl logo. So, without further ado, point your web-browsers at:
>
> http://beverley2.digital-word.com/mod_perl/winner/
>
> The winning logo, designed by Michael Demers (mike [at] inteo.com), won
> by a very clear majority. Congratulations Mike, and thanks for a great
> effort!
I like it. I voted for a different one, but I like this one the best. I
must have overlooked it when voting.
> However, I request your comments on this idea: should we have just one
> button (helping to develop a distinct identity for mod_perl) or should
> we have several (for choice)? It's up to you...
A single button that matches the logo will be simplier, and more
distinct. Too many choices is making it harder for the newcomers.
Wim
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Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by John Saylor <jo...@worldwinner.com>.
Hi
( 02.03.15 10:03 -0000 ) Jonathan M. Hollin:
> However, I request your comments on this idea: should we have just one
> button (helping to develop a distinct identity for mod_perl) or should
> we have several (for choice)? It's up to you...
TMTOWTDI, of course- multiple buttons!
--
\js "scale transparent e-tailers"
RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: Was there a button in the same style as the winning logo?
:: Could Michael be persuaded to create one if not?
::
:: I'm inclined to think a new logo is little use if you're not
:: consistent with the imagery it uses. Tying a button design
:: into that imagery is, IMO, essential.
I will forward your email on to Michael (who designed the winning logo).
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: Was there a button in the same style as the winning logo?
:: Could Michael be persuaded to create one if not?
::
:: I'm inclined to think a new logo is little use if you're not
:: consistent with the imagery it uses. Tying a button design
:: into that imagery is, IMO, essential.
Michael Demers (the designer) will submit a few buttons, to match his
logo design, in the near future.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
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RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: Was there a button in the same style as the winning logo?
:: Could Michael be persuaded to create one if not?
::
:: I'm inclined to think a new logo is little use if you're not
:: consistent with the imagery it uses. Tying a button design
:: into that imagery is, IMO, essential.
I will forward your email on to Michael (who designed the winning logo).
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: docs-dev-unsubscribe@perl.apache.org
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RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: Was there a button in the same style as the winning logo?
:: Could Michael be persuaded to create one if not?
::
:: I'm inclined to think a new logo is little use if you're not
:: consistent with the imagery it uses. Tying a button design
:: into that imagery is, IMO, essential.
Michael Demers (the designer) will submit a few buttons, to match his
logo design, in the near future.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Andrew Green <an...@article7.co.uk>.
In article <00...@orpheus>,
Jonathan M. Hollin <ne...@digital-word.com> wrote:
> However, I request your comments on this idea...
Was there a button in the same style as the winning logo? Could Michael
be persuaded to create one if not?
I'm inclined to think a new logo is little use if you're not consistent
with the imagery it uses. Tying a button design into that imagery is,
IMO, essential.
All the best,
Andrew.
--
perl -MLWP::Simple -e 'getprint("http://www.article7.co.uk/res/japh.txt");'
Re: [OT][ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Garth Winter Webb <ga...@perijove.com>.
On Sat, 2002-03-16 at 08:01, c.hauser@itassistance.ch wrote:
> Recently I had a discussion with a Java programmer, who said that
> mod_perl is a try to save the obsolete language Perl. His argument was
> that only Java programmers are searched, especially here in Europe.
Interesting. I have a friend that works for Sun whos job it is to find
companies and products that use Java and compile them into a database of
success stories. His job has become increasingly difficult over the
past year. Arguments about being obsolete aside, of Java and Perl, one
language is seems to be growing and one seems to be dying...
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Ask Bjoern Hansen <as...@valueclick.com>.
On Sat, 16 Mar 2002 c.hauser@itassistance.ch wrote:
[...]
> To make things thing even more complicated I agree the need of a name
> with a sounding image, which will help mod_perl to grow into corporate
> computing (our future jobs).
>
> Recently I had a discussion with a Java programmer, who said that
> mod_perl is a try to save the obsolete language Perl. His argument was
> that only Java programmers are searched, especially here in Europe.
>
> So I see three requirements:
> - Having a name and logo which tells the truth,
> it's Perl and it was good.
> - The name should defer to Perl, should be it's own brand.
> - The sounding must be stronger then API
Please go back to the marketing people and tell them to smoke
somewhere else.
o) mod_perl is the perl apache module. Apache modules are called
mod_foo.c.
o) It is "just" an interface to the Apache API.
o) We've had this discussion several times before; I even had to
check the year on the postings to be sure that I was not
replying to an old thread. Please stop.
- ask
--
ask bjoern hansen, http://ask.netcetera.dk/ !try; do();
more than a billion impressions per week, http://valueclick.com
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by c....@itassistance.ch.
> A thought - what about putting the suggestion of an underscore by
> putting bars underneath the d and p of "modperl"? Just a suggestion
> to Michael as presumably he is revisting the design for the buttons.
This is a funny discussion. Although not my favorite Logo has been
elected, I confirm the need of a uniform design over all logo
representations!
> so why do we cling to mod_perl as a name? i suppose for the familiar
> historical reasons, it's a fond term of endearment to us. but it would be
> more descriptive to call it "The Apache perl API" or "Apache-Embedded perl",
> would it not? it behooves us to ride along on Apache's name-recognition
> doesn't it?
To make things thing even more complicated I agree the need of a name
with a sounding image, which will help mod_perl to grow into corporate
computing (our future jobs).
Recently I had a discussion with a Java programmer, who said that
mod_perl is a try to save the obsolete language Perl. His argument was
that only Java programmers are searched, especially here in Europe.
So I see three requirements:
- Having a name and logo which tells the truth,
it's Perl and it was good.
- The name should defer to Perl, should be it's own brand.
- The sounding must be stronger then API
> putting bars underneath the d and p of "modperl"? Just a suggestion
First I liked the idea 'DP' oder 'dPerl'. On the other hand we
have the A, which stands for Apache, Application ... A is first, is
best.
So I came to aPerl or Parl 'Practical Application R* Language'?
On and on just some funny thoughts :-)
BR Christian
========== beginn original ==========
Date: Freitag, 15. März 2002, 11:03:59
Subject: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Fellow mod_perl hackers...
It is with great pleasure that I am able to introduce you to the new
mod_perl logo. So, without further ado, point your web-browsers at:
http://beverley2.digital-word.com/mod_perl/winner/
The winning logo, designed by Michael Demers (mike [at] inteo.com), won
by a very clear majority. Congratulations Mike, and thanks for a great
effort!
The new mod_perl button vote resulted in a tie between two designs:
Juergen Spechts' (the existing button) and new design by Tyler
Rorabaugh. Following a brief discussion with Stas (stas [at]
stason.org), I think it might be a good idea to have several mod_perl
buttons, the idea being that a designer can then choose a button that
doesn't conflict with his/her design.
However, I request your comments on this idea: should we have just one
button (helping to develop a distinct identity for mod_perl) or should
we have several (for choice)? It's up to you...
Thank you to everyone who participated in this project. Kudos to the
designers for their efforts. Thanks to Stas for his input and ideas,
and Eric Cholet for the voting script.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
=========== end original ============
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Wim Kerkhoff <wi...@merilus.com>.
"Jonathan M. Hollin" wrote:
>
> Fellow mod_perl hackers...
>
> It is with great pleasure that I am able to introduce you to the new
> mod_perl logo. So, without further ado, point your web-browsers at:
>
> http://beverley2.digital-word.com/mod_perl/winner/
>
> The winning logo, designed by Michael Demers (mike [at] inteo.com), won
> by a very clear majority. Congratulations Mike, and thanks for a great
> effort!
I like it. I voted for a different one, but I like this one the best. I
must have overlooked it when voting.
> However, I request your comments on this idea: should we have just one
> button (helping to develop a distinct identity for mod_perl) or should
> we have several (for choice)? It's up to you...
A single button that matches the logo will be simplier, and more
distinct. Too many choices is making it harder for the newcomers.
Wim
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Bill Moseley <mo...@hank.org>.
At 04:33 PM 03/15/02 -0500, Georgy Vladimirov wrote:
>I actually like the logo without the underscore. I don't think an
>underscore is very collaborative with art. The "_" has always been
>irritating me a little.
>
>I know that there is history and nostalgia involved here but dropping
>an underscore at least in the logo is a nice evolution IMHO.
I also agree with this, and is one of the reasons (I think) I voted for
that design. It's a graphic design so I don't see that it needs to follow
the Apache module naming convention exactly. Nor perl identifier names,
either. Many of the designs offered didn't use the underscore as well.
And the design that won didn't use one. It's a design -- it doesn't have
to be accurate to the name.
Besides, if it changes does it mean that the winning design received no
votes? ;)
--
Bill Moseley
mailto:moseley@hank.org
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Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Geoffrey Young <ge...@modperlcookbook.org>.
David Ranney wrote:
>
> All,
>
> I really like the new logo, and in fact I voted for it. However, I just
> realized that the logo uses "modperl", whereas mod_perl's name is
> "mod_perl", with the underscore. Does anyone else see this as a problem?
> I've always been annoyed at how often the spelling gets modified, and it
> seems that the logo as it is now would add to the confusion. Am I just
> picking nits?
no, I'd agree here. it's mod_perl, not Mod_perl, not Mod_Perl, not
modperl...
--Geoff
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Bill Moseley <mo...@hank.org>.
At 04:33 PM 03/15/02 -0500, Georgy Vladimirov wrote:
>I actually like the logo without the underscore. I don't think an
>underscore is very collaborative with art. The "_" has always been
>irritating me a little.
>
>I know that there is history and nostalgia involved here but dropping
>an underscore at least in the logo is a nice evolution IMHO.
I also agree with this, and is one of the reasons (I think) I voted for
that design. It's a graphic design so I don't see that it needs to follow
the Apache module naming convention exactly. Nor perl identifier names,
either. Many of the designs offered didn't use the underscore as well.
And the design that won didn't use one. It's a design -- it doesn't have
to be accurate to the name.
Besides, if it changes does it mean that the winning design received no
votes? ;)
--
Bill Moseley
mailto:moseley@hank.org
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Ade Olonoh <ol...@yahoo.com>.
> The underscore really belongs to the "C/C++" language and isn't really
> so much of a standard in Perl.
Not true. From perlstyle:
While short identifiers like $gotit are probably ok,
use underscores to separate words. It is generally
easier to read $var_names_like_this than $VarNamesLikeThis,
especially for non-native speakers of English. It's also
a simple rule that works consistently with VAR_NAMES_LIKE_THIS.
--Ade.
[OT] underscores vs. init caps
Posted by Perrin Harkins <pe...@elem.com>.
Georgy Vladimirov wrote:
> The Java people escaped from the underscore and started
> capitalization.
underscores_are_much_easier_to_read ThanSomeSillyCapitalizationScheme.
Underscores are the standard for Perl variable names, and for good reason.
Anyway, it's a moot point because the name isn't changing.
- Perrin
What's in a name? (was: Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...)
Posted by David Kaufman <dk...@nac.net>.
"Georgy Vladimirov" <vl...@money.com> wrote:
> I actually like the logo without the underscore. I don't think an
> underscore is very collaborative with art. The "_" has always been
> irritating me a little.
>
> I know that there is history and nostalgia involved here but dropping
> an underscore at least in the logo is a nice evolution IMHO. The whole
> "mod_" just happens to be the original Apache naming convention
i agree.
"mod_perl" looks like more like a variable name than a technology, much less
a *brand*. it has a certain coolness factor all it's own, but the coolness
is lost on anyone who isn't a programmer, or more specifically, a mod_perl
programmer! it just inspires more questions than answers.
i cannot tell you how many times i've told someone i was a mod_perl
programmer and then watched as the eyes of my prospective employer glazed
over as they apparently thought, "a what programmer? is that like a
computer programmer?" okay maybe i wouldn't have been happy working for
those folks anyway, but sometimes you'd be happy working for any folks and
*those* are the times we wish mod_perl had a glossier finish, more brand
recognition, maybe some buzz in some business magazines and, you know, the
fame that it deserves.
i'm sure that many business executives who have very immediate problems that
mod_perl (and a mod_perl programmer) could easily solve read (what little
there is) in the press about mod_perl and wonder, "how does one pronounce
this? mod-underscore-perl? what does *mod* mean?" if it was an acronym
they could at least investigate what the letters stood for, and then look up
those words. but mod_ just seems to be whimsically short
for... --something. modified perl? modern perl? is it pronounced "moad"
maybe? is it modal? it's an apache thing? well, why didn't you *say* so?"
(apache gets a pretty good amount of buzz, even out there in the
non-programmer world, for an open-source technology).
some other webserver-specific language API names are easier to fathom. some
are even easier to pronounce. ISAPI is easily spoken and easy to fathom
(once one knows what the letters stand for) if not so easy to afford. NSAPI
is similarly fathomable. a CEO can even find out what CGI is, without
having to embarrass themselves by asking a geek.
so why do we cling to mod_perl as a name? i suppose for the familiar
historical reasons, it's a fond term of endearment to us. but it would be
more descriptive to call it "The Apache perl API" or "Apache-Embedded perl",
would it not? it behooves us to ride along on Apache's name-recognition
doesn't it?
mod_perl, as a name simply does not do justice to the most powerfule and
popular programming language on Earth, embedded into the most powerful and
popular webserver on Earth, does it? no, of course not. so i say we ditch
the new logo (though i did vote for it and do like it a lot, sans_underscore
and all) and propose that we change the name summarily and forthwith TO:
(drum roll, please...)
The Apache-perl API
(or tApAPI for short) it's pronounceable, alliterative, memorable.... and
hey, it almost rhymes with Apache! ok, and slap-happy. well either that or
"Grape Apey", but let's not go there.
what more could anyone want in a name?
-dave
RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: I actually like the logo without the underscore. I don't
:: think an underscore is very collaborative with art. The "_"
:: has always been irritating me a little.
I don't see any reason why the underscore can't be incorporated
"discreetly". I had an idea that we could have the "dp" together (like
in the new logo) with a small underscore directly beneath them.
:: I know that there is history and nostalgia involved here but
:: dropping an underscore at least in the logo is a nice
:: evolution IMHO. The whole "mod_" just happens to be the
:: original Apache naming convention for modules, I believe,
:: and let's not forget that the Apache folks never thought
:: they would get the kind of success they have. Given the
:: choice, I don't think they would have stuck with this kind
:: of naming convention.
This doesn't matter. The simple fact is, the name is mod_perl. It's
established, known and the author has stated quite clearly that it will
not change.
:: The underscore really belongs to the "C/C++" language and
:: isn't really so much of a standard in Perl. True, "Perl",
:: "Apache" and "mod_perl" are all children of "C/C++" but they
:: should have some independence - they are in their
:: adolescence now (if not even adults).
If the underscore "belongs" anywhere, then it also belongs in Perl.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
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RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: I actually like the logo without the underscore. I don't
:: think an underscore is very collaborative with art. The "_"
:: has always been irritating me a little.
I don't see any reason why the underscore can't be incorporated
"discreetly". I had an idea that we could have the "dp" together (like
in the new logo) with a small underscore directly beneath them.
:: I know that there is history and nostalgia involved here but
:: dropping an underscore at least in the logo is a nice
:: evolution IMHO. The whole "mod_" just happens to be the
:: original Apache naming convention for modules, I believe,
:: and let's not forget that the Apache folks never thought
:: they would get the kind of success they have. Given the
:: choice, I don't think they would have stuck with this kind
:: of naming convention.
This doesn't matter. The simple fact is, the name is mod_perl. It's
established, known and the author has stated quite clearly that it will
not change.
:: The underscore really belongs to the "C/C++" language and
:: isn't really so much of a standard in Perl. True, "Perl",
:: "Apache" and "mod_perl" are all children of "C/C++" but they
:: should have some independence - they are in their
:: adolescence now (if not even adults).
If the underscore "belongs" anywhere, then it also belongs in Perl.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Georgy Vladimirov <vl...@money.com>.
I actually like the logo without the underscore. I don't think an
underscore is very collaborative with art. The "_" has always been
irritating me a little.
I know that there is history and nostalgia involved here but dropping
an underscore at least in the logo is a nice evolution IMHO. The whole
"mod_" just happens to be the original Apache naming convention for
modules, I believe, and let's not forget that the Apache folks never
thought they would get the kind of success they have. Given the
choice, I don't think they would have stuck with this kind of naming
convention.
The underscore really belongs to the "C/C++" language and isn't really
so much of a standard in Perl. True, "Perl", "Apache" and "mod_perl"
are all children of "C/C++" but they should have some independence -
they are in their adolescence now (if not even adults).
The Java people escaped from the underscore and started
capitalization. The underscore is something very practical that all of
us use on a daily basis but it isn't pretty. And that's what we need
in a logo - style and beauty - and the logo we have now is excellent.
Think about MTV, people didn't limit themselves in placing the letters
when they were creating the logo, nobody complained that the TV came
apart from the M. I am sure our artist chose to drop the underscore
for artistic reasons...
Sorry for my dissent and for polluting the list with an opinion on
logos :-)
Georgy.
David Ranney wrote:
>
> All,
>
> I really like the new logo, and in fact I voted for it. However, I just
> realized that the logo uses "modperl", whereas mod_perl's name is
> "mod_perl", with the underscore. Does anyone else see this as a problem?
> I've always been annoyed at how often the spelling gets modified, and it
> seems that the logo as it is now would add to the confusion. Am I just
> picking nits?
>
> -Dave
>
> David Ranney
> Senior Web Applications Developer
> e-Perception, Inc.
> (909) 587-8773
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Ged Haywood <ge...@www2.jubileegroup.co.uk>.
Hi there,
On Fri, 15 Mar 2002, David Ranney wrote:
> I really like the new logo, and in fact I voted for it. However, I just
> realized that the logo uses "modperl", whereas mod_perl's name is
> "mod_perl", with the underscore. Does anyone else see this as a problem?
> I've always been annoyed at how often the spelling gets modified, and it
> seems that the logo as it is now would add to the confusion. Am I just
> picking nits?
You are quite right. It's definitely not picking nits, it's important.
73,
Ged.
RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: I really like the new logo, and in fact I voted for it.
:: However, I just realized that the logo uses "modperl",
:: whereas mod_perl's name is "mod_perl", with the underscore.
:: Does anyone else see this as a problem? I've always been
:: annoyed at how often the spelling gets modified, and it
:: seems that the logo as it is now would add to the confusion.
:: Am I just picking nits?
This has been a addressed. A "cleaned-up" logo will be appearing
shortly. As will a vector-based version (so we can get t-shirts printed
:-) )...
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
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RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: I really like the new logo, and in fact I voted for it.
:: However, I just realized that the logo uses "modperl",
:: whereas mod_perl's name is "mod_perl", with the underscore.
:: Does anyone else see this as a problem? I've always been
:: annoyed at how often the spelling gets modified, and it
:: seems that the logo as it is now would add to the confusion.
:: Am I just picking nits?
This has been a addressed. A "cleaned-up" logo will be appearing
shortly. As will a vector-based version (so we can get t-shirts printed
:-) )...
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by David Ranney <dr...@e-perception.com>.
All,
I really like the new logo, and in fact I voted for it. However, I just
realized that the logo uses "modperl", whereas mod_perl's name is
"mod_perl", with the underscore. Does anyone else see this as a problem?
I've always been annoyed at how often the spelling gets modified, and it
seems that the logo as it is now would add to the confusion. Am I just
picking nits?
-Dave
David Ranney
Senior Web Applications Developer
e-Perception, Inc.
(909) 587-8773
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Matt Sergeant <ma...@sergeant.org>.
OK, here's my attempt at SVGing the logo. Works in Adobe's SVG viewer
(Linux and Windows). I'll work on animating it next (making the cog spin).
--
<!-- Matt -->
<:->Get a smart net</:->
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Matt Sergeant <ma...@sergeant.org>.
On Mon, 18 Mar 2002, Steve Piner wrote:
> I definitely agree with this. I'd like to see some more colour
> variations (maybe just background colours even) to allow it to fit into
> a site's design better.
>
> Jonathan asked whether we should have just one button, or several. I'd
> say just one theme, with several variations as mentioned above.
This is dead easy to do with the SVG version. Feel free to hack around
with it.
--
<!-- Matt -->
<:->Get a smart net</:->
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Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Matt Sergeant <ma...@sergeant.org>.
On Mon, 18 Mar 2002, Steve Piner wrote:
> I definitely agree with this. I'd like to see some more colour
> variations (maybe just background colours even) to allow it to fit into
> a site's design better.
>
> Jonathan asked whether we should have just one button, or several. I'd
> say just one theme, with several variations as mentioned above.
This is dead easy to do with the SVG version. Feel free to hack around
with it.
--
<!-- Matt -->
<:->Get a smart net</:->
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Steve Piner <st...@marketview.co.nz>.
Mark Fowler wrote:
>
> On Fri, 15 Mar 2002, Jonathan M. Hollin wrote:
>
> > However, I request your comments on this idea: should we have just one
> > button (helping to develop a distinct identity for mod_perl) or should
> > we have several (for choice)? It's up to you...
>
> I think that we need one "theme" of buttons, to ensure consistent
> branding. As per my comments when I voted stated, I'd love to see some
> buttons/logos based on the winning logo. In particular:
>
> - A square button that's just made up of the square cog logo
> - A square button that's just made up of a grey m and a blue p
> - A small rectangle version of the words modperl without the cog
>
> ...you get the idea, variations around a central design
>
> Also, we could do with both a monochrome and a black and white version of
> the logo (for print.)
>
> Is the logo available in a vector file format so that we can easily make
> scaled copies of it? Or are we restricted to the pixel banners that
> currently exist?
>
> Later.
>
> Mark.
>
> --
> s'' Mark Fowler London.pm Bath.pm
> http://www.twoshortplanks.com/ mark@twoshortplanks.com
> ';use Term'Cap;$t=Tgetent Term'Cap{};print$t->Tputs(cl);for$w(split/ +/
> ){for(0..30){$|=print$t->Tgoto(cm,$_,$y)." $w";select$k,$k,$k,.03}$y+=2}
I definitely agree with this. I'd like to see some more colour
variations (maybe just background colours even) to allow it to fit into
a site's design better.
Jonathan asked whether we should have just one button, or several. I'd
say just one theme, with several variations as mentioned above.
Others have suggested several buttons and I'm assuming they mean with
differing themes. I'm against that, as the point of a logo is to
reinforce the branding of mod_perl. Of course, if people don't want to
use this theme, they won't. That's fine. That's no worse than the
current situation.
Finally, I think the mod_perl/modperl/ModPerl/Mod_perl thing is a
non-issue. We all know what is being talked about, right? It's nowhere
near as bad as the .gif "hard 'G' or soft 'G'" or the vi "V.I. versus
'vie'" problems.
Steve
--
Steve Piner
Web Applications Developer
Marketview Limited
http://www.marketview.co.nz
RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: If we can find out what the font is, I'd enjoy trying to do
:: an SVG version (I just bought an SVG book, so I'm enjoying playing).
I'll find out.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
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RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Matt Sergeant <ma...@sergeant.org>.
On Fri, 15 Mar 2002, Jonathan M. Hollin wrote:
> :: Is the logo available in a vector file format so that we can
> :: easily make
> :: scaled copies of it? Or are we restricted to the pixel banners that
> :: currently exist?
>
> All I have is non-vector JPEG. Again, I'll ask Michael.
If we can find out what the font is, I'd enjoy trying to do an SVG version
(I just bought an SVG book, so I'm enjoying playing).
--
<!-- Matt -->
<:->Get a smart net</:->
RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: I think that we need one "theme" of buttons, to ensure
:: consistent branding. As per my comments when I voted
:: stated, I'd love to see some buttons/logos based on the
:: winning logo. In particular:
::
:: - A square button that's just made up of the square cog logo
:: - A square button that's just made up of a grey m and a blue p
:: - A small rectangle version of the words modperl without the cog
::
:: ...you get the idea, variations around a central design
::
:: Also, we could do with both a monochrome and a black and
:: white version of
:: the logo (for print.)
Personally, I agree. I'll forward your email on to Michael and we'll
see how he responds.
:: Is the logo available in a vector file format so that we can
:: easily make
:: scaled copies of it? Or are we restricted to the pixel banners that
:: currently exist?
All I have is non-vector JPEG. Again, I'll ask Michael.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
RE: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by "Jonathan M. Hollin" <ne...@digital-word.com>.
:: I think that we need one "theme" of buttons, to ensure
:: consistent branding. As per my comments when I voted
:: stated, I'd love to see some buttons/logos based on the
:: winning logo. In particular:
::
:: - A square button that's just made up of the square cog logo
:: - A square button that's just made up of a grey m and a blue p
:: - A small rectangle version of the words modperl without the cog
::
:: ...you get the idea, variations around a central design
::
:: Also, we could do with both a monochrome and a black and
:: white version of
:: the logo (for print.)
Personally, I agree. I'll forward your email on to Michael and we'll
see how he responds.
:: Is the logo available in a vector file format so that we can
:: easily make
:: scaled copies of it? Or are we restricted to the pixel banners that
:: currently exist?
All I have is non-vector JPEG. Again, I'll ask Michael.
Jonathan M. Hollin - WYPUG Co-ordinator
West Yorkshire Perl User Group
http://wypug.pm.org/ <-- Temporarily off-line
http://wypug.digital-word.com/
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Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Mark Fowler <ma...@twoshortplanks.com>.
On Fri, 15 Mar 2002, Jonathan M. Hollin wrote:
> However, I request your comments on this idea: should we have just one
> button (helping to develop a distinct identity for mod_perl) or should
> we have several (for choice)? It's up to you...
I think that we need one "theme" of buttons, to ensure consistent
branding. As per my comments when I voted stated, I'd love to see some
buttons/logos based on the winning logo. In particular:
- A square button that's just made up of the square cog logo
- A square button that's just made up of a grey m and a blue p
- A small rectangle version of the words modperl without the cog
...you get the idea, variations around a central design
Also, we could do with both a monochrome and a black and white version of
the logo (for print.)
Is the logo available in a vector file format so that we can easily make
scaled copies of it? Or are we restricted to the pixel banners that
currently exist?
Later.
Mark.
--
s'' Mark Fowler London.pm Bath.pm
http://www.twoshortplanks.com/ mark@twoshortplanks.com
';use Term'Cap;$t=Tgetent Term'Cap{};print$t->Tputs(cl);for$w(split/ +/
){for(0..30){$|=print$t->Tgoto(cm,$_,$y)." $w";select$k,$k,$k,.03}$y+=2}
Re: [ANNOUNCE] The New "mod_perl" logo - results now in...
Posted by Matt Sergeant <ma...@sergeant.org>.
OK, here's my attempt at SVGing the logo. Works in Adobe's SVG viewer
(Linux and Windows). I'll work on animating it next (making the cog spin).
--
<!-- Matt -->
<:->Get a smart net</:->