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Posted to dev@chukwa.apache.org by "Alan D. Cabrera" <li...@toolazydogs.com> on 2012/07/03 15:26:28 UTC
Re: Shepherding: chukwa, mesos, directmemory
On Jul 3, 2012, at 5:40 AM, Jukka Zitting wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Mon, Jul 2, 2012 at 6:27 AM, Alan D. Cabrera <li...@toolazydogs.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 1, 2012, at 12:46 PM, Benson Margulies wrote:
>>>> Chuckwa looks pretty normal; report in place, traffic on mailing list.
>>>> I don't see any particular cause for concern. It's one of our podlings that
>>> is all set except for not having added committers. Mentors, do you think
>>> they could graduate anyhow?
>>
>> I was thinking that it should go into the Hadoop as a subproject or to the attic.
>> I see one developer valiantly holding the fort. Great guy. Nice body of code.
>> Not a lot of developers working on it.
>
> I notice the report mentions patches from new contributors. Should
> some of them be granted committership?
>
> I'd recommend keeping the entry barrier low for new committers
> especially if there isn't much activity otherwise.
Eric claims five new contributors submitting patches since April and I only count 3 people submitting 4 patches. The patches are non-trivial.
So the idea is to give the contributors committership and hope things take off? Eric does want to make one more release. Maybe that will churn some enthusiasm. Eric is very tenacious about keeping it open and he is very timely with the mailing list discussions and submitted patches.
I'm inclined to give it another shot but I'm wondering what criteria do we use to decide that we've done all we've can.
Regards,
Alan
Re: Shepherding: chukwa, mesos, directmemory
Posted by Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com>.
On Tue, Jul 3, 2012 at 7:35 AM, Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Not sure if it's the case here (I don't follow Chukwa in detail), but
> I know some projects where a highly active lead developer has actually
> held back the community even though he had all the best intentions in
> mind. Instead of directly jumping in and fixing issues that people
> encounter, it's often a better long-term idea to help them come up
> with a solution themselves.
+1
Supplying an elaborate recipe for fixing a bug or implementing a feature and
actively soliciting a patch can be more effective at engaging a
potential contributor
than committing it yourself. Basically, give them 75% of the patch but then
leave them hanging so that they have to take action to get their concern
addressed.
Not everyone wants to be a core contributor, so things won't always work out.
And if you think the feature or bug fix is important, at some point you have to
give up on the recruitment effort and just finish it yourself. But
it's worthwhile to
hold off for a few weeks if you can.
Marvin Humphrey
Re: Shepherding: chukwa, mesos, directmemory
Posted by Ahmed Fathalla <af...@gmail.com>.
As the most recent person added as a Chukwa committer I think we should
give the project a chance.
I think Chukwa has suffered from a lack of interest in the Hadoop
community, maybe adding more committers would help. I think we need people
who would write articles about Chukwa in technical publications more than
we need people who code.
On Tue, Jul 3, 2012 at 4:35 PM, Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Tue, Jul 3, 2012 at 3:26 PM, Alan D. Cabrera <li...@toolazydogs.com>
> wrote:
> > So the idea is to give the contributors committership and hope things
> take off?
>
> Seems like a good idea to me, especially if Chukwa hasn't tried doing
> that before.
>
> > Eric does want to make one more release. Maybe that will churn some
> enthusiasm.
> > Eric is very tenacious about keeping it open and he is very timely with
> the mailing
> > list discussions and submitted patches.
>
> Not sure if it's the case here (I don't follow Chukwa in detail), but
> I know some projects where a highly active lead developer has actually
> held back the community even though he had all the best intentions in
> mind. Instead of directly jumping in and fixing issues that people
> encounter, it's often a better long-term idea to help them come up
> with a solution themselves. That approach obviously doesn't work with
> all users, but with some such empowerment can be highly rewarding.
> "Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime." [*]
>
> > I'm inclined to give it another shot but I'm wondering what criteria do
> we use
> > to decide that we've done all we've can.
>
> I guess the best criteria is when people run out of ideas or the
> energy to implement them.
>
> Basically incubation of a project makes sense for as long as there's
> ongoing progress towards graduation. Once progress is no longer being
> made, it's time for a podling to exit the Incubator in one way or
> another.
>
> [*] Apparently originally by Anne Isabella Ritchie in 1885
> (http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/give-a-man-a-fish.html), though
> the proverb is widely attributed to various other sources ranging from
> the Bible to Tao Te Ching.
>
> BR,
>
> Jukka Zitting
>
--
Ahmed Fathalla
Re: Shepherding: chukwa, mesos, directmemory
Posted by Ahmed Fathalla <af...@gmail.com>.
As the most recent person added as a Chukwa committer I think we should
give the project a chance.
I think Chukwa has suffered from a lack of interest in the Hadoop
community, maybe adding more committers would help. I think we need people
who would write articles about Chukwa in technical publications more than
we need people who code.
On Tue, Jul 3, 2012 at 4:35 PM, Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Tue, Jul 3, 2012 at 3:26 PM, Alan D. Cabrera <li...@toolazydogs.com>
> wrote:
> > So the idea is to give the contributors committership and hope things
> take off?
>
> Seems like a good idea to me, especially if Chukwa hasn't tried doing
> that before.
>
> > Eric does want to make one more release. Maybe that will churn some
> enthusiasm.
> > Eric is very tenacious about keeping it open and he is very timely with
> the mailing
> > list discussions and submitted patches.
>
> Not sure if it's the case here (I don't follow Chukwa in detail), but
> I know some projects where a highly active lead developer has actually
> held back the community even though he had all the best intentions in
> mind. Instead of directly jumping in and fixing issues that people
> encounter, it's often a better long-term idea to help them come up
> with a solution themselves. That approach obviously doesn't work with
> all users, but with some such empowerment can be highly rewarding.
> "Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime." [*]
>
> > I'm inclined to give it another shot but I'm wondering what criteria do
> we use
> > to decide that we've done all we've can.
>
> I guess the best criteria is when people run out of ideas or the
> energy to implement them.
>
> Basically incubation of a project makes sense for as long as there's
> ongoing progress towards graduation. Once progress is no longer being
> made, it's time for a podling to exit the Incubator in one way or
> another.
>
> [*] Apparently originally by Anne Isabella Ritchie in 1885
> (http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/give-a-man-a-fish.html), though
> the proverb is widely attributed to various other sources ranging from
> the Bible to Tao Te Ching.
>
> BR,
>
> Jukka Zitting
>
--
Ahmed Fathalla
Re: Shepherding: chukwa, mesos, directmemory
Posted by Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com>.
On Tue, Jul 3, 2012 at 7:35 AM, Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Not sure if it's the case here (I don't follow Chukwa in detail), but
> I know some projects where a highly active lead developer has actually
> held back the community even though he had all the best intentions in
> mind. Instead of directly jumping in and fixing issues that people
> encounter, it's often a better long-term idea to help them come up
> with a solution themselves.
+1
Supplying an elaborate recipe for fixing a bug or implementing a feature and
actively soliciting a patch can be more effective at engaging a
potential contributor
than committing it yourself. Basically, give them 75% of the patch but then
leave them hanging so that they have to take action to get their concern
addressed.
Not everyone wants to be a core contributor, so things won't always work out.
And if you think the feature or bug fix is important, at some point you have to
give up on the recruitment effort and just finish it yourself. But
it's worthwhile to
hold off for a few weeks if you can.
Marvin Humphrey
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Re: Shepherding: chukwa, mesos, directmemory
Posted by Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com>.
Hi,
On Tue, Jul 3, 2012 at 3:26 PM, Alan D. Cabrera <li...@toolazydogs.com> wrote:
> So the idea is to give the contributors committership and hope things take off?
Seems like a good idea to me, especially if Chukwa hasn't tried doing
that before.
> Eric does want to make one more release. Maybe that will churn some enthusiasm.
> Eric is very tenacious about keeping it open and he is very timely with the mailing
> list discussions and submitted patches.
Not sure if it's the case here (I don't follow Chukwa in detail), but
I know some projects where a highly active lead developer has actually
held back the community even though he had all the best intentions in
mind. Instead of directly jumping in and fixing issues that people
encounter, it's often a better long-term idea to help them come up
with a solution themselves. That approach obviously doesn't work with
all users, but with some such empowerment can be highly rewarding.
"Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime." [*]
> I'm inclined to give it another shot but I'm wondering what criteria do we use
> to decide that we've done all we've can.
I guess the best criteria is when people run out of ideas or the
energy to implement them.
Basically incubation of a project makes sense for as long as there's
ongoing progress towards graduation. Once progress is no longer being
made, it's time for a podling to exit the Incubator in one way or
another.
[*] Apparently originally by Anne Isabella Ritchie in 1885
(http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/give-a-man-a-fish.html), though
the proverb is widely attributed to various other sources ranging from
the Bible to Tao Te Ching.
BR,
Jukka Zitting
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
Re: Shepherding: chukwa, mesos, directmemory
Posted by Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com>.
Hi,
On Tue, Jul 3, 2012 at 3:26 PM, Alan D. Cabrera <li...@toolazydogs.com> wrote:
> So the idea is to give the contributors committership and hope things take off?
Seems like a good idea to me, especially if Chukwa hasn't tried doing
that before.
> Eric does want to make one more release. Maybe that will churn some enthusiasm.
> Eric is very tenacious about keeping it open and he is very timely with the mailing
> list discussions and submitted patches.
Not sure if it's the case here (I don't follow Chukwa in detail), but
I know some projects where a highly active lead developer has actually
held back the community even though he had all the best intentions in
mind. Instead of directly jumping in and fixing issues that people
encounter, it's often a better long-term idea to help them come up
with a solution themselves. That approach obviously doesn't work with
all users, but with some such empowerment can be highly rewarding.
"Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime." [*]
> I'm inclined to give it another shot but I'm wondering what criteria do we use
> to decide that we've done all we've can.
I guess the best criteria is when people run out of ideas or the
energy to implement them.
Basically incubation of a project makes sense for as long as there's
ongoing progress towards graduation. Once progress is no longer being
made, it's time for a podling to exit the Incubator in one way or
another.
[*] Apparently originally by Anne Isabella Ritchie in 1885
(http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/give-a-man-a-fish.html), though
the proverb is widely attributed to various other sources ranging from
the Bible to Tao Te Ching.
BR,
Jukka Zitting