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Posted to dev@commons.apache.org by Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org> on 2004/02/28 21:12:54 UTC
[Resources] Presence vs. contrib
The database implementations of Resources are currently under a contrib
directory, which seems to imply that they are somehow second class
citizens to the other implementations. I'd prefer to see them up there
with the best of them. ;-)
Perhaps we could use a 'presence' test, as Chain does, to determine
whether or not these pieces are built, and then integrate them more fully
into the Resources build?
--
Martin Cooper
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Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
Posted by "Craig R. McClanahan" <cr...@apache.org>.
Quoting James Mitchell <jm...@apache.org>:
>
> That sounds great. I'll look at getting that done soon, although to be
> honest, I'm about to get a book deal so when that happens it will pretty
> much consume every non-working or non-sleeping minute of my time.
Good luck! From everything that I've seen and heard from book authors, writing
code is fun but writing words is work :-).
Craig
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Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
Posted by James Mitchell <jm...@apache.org>.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig R. McClanahan" <cr...@apache.org>
To: "Jakarta Commons Developers List" <co...@jakarta.apache.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 5:44 PM
Subject: Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
> Quoting James Mitchell <jm...@apache.org>:
>
> >
> > I'm not sure how you want to handle the tests that require a database
> > configuration and connection (??Craig??). They run fine for me with a
> > simple mysql install.
>
> How about if we create a test dependency on hsqldb (or some equivalent
embedded
> SQL database with a JDBC driver)? Since it runs in the same process, it
could
> be managed pretty much like any other test.
That sounds great. I'll look at getting that done soon, although to be
honest, I'm about to get a book deal so when that happens it will pretty
much consume every non-working or non-sleeping minute of my time.
>
> >
> > As far as building/dist-ing, Maven is giving me fits. I am fighting
with
> > Maven to get it to do what I need (per last discussion about
distributions
> > and struts plugins, etc), but I'm just not that familiar with it.
> >
>
> I'm glad someone else is cutting their teeth on Maven building so I can
just
> benefit from their experience when it's done :-).
'cutting teeth' is a VERY polite way of putting it :)
>
> > I'm not complaining about Maven specifically, I just hate feeling stupid
> > with this or any neat tool ;)
> >
> > Much like the discussions/arguments about jsp vs. velocity, Maven might
be
> > cool and might even be more powerful than Ant, but I am just not as
> > knowledgable with Maven as I am with Ant build scripts.
> >
> > I'm going to move them to the main src directory, but I will need some
> > assistence getting the tests to pass.
> >
> >
> > --
> > James Mitchell
> > Software Engineer / Open Source Evangelist
> > EdgeTech, Inc.
> > 678.910.8017
> > AIM: jmitchtx
> > MSN: jmitchell@apache.org
> >
>
> Craig
>
--
James Mitchell
Software Engineer / Open Source Evangelist
EdgeTech, Inc.
678.910.8017
AIM: jmitchtx
MSN: jmitchell@apache.org
Yahoo IM:jmitchtx@yahoo.com
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Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
Posted by "Craig R. McClanahan" <cr...@apache.org>.
Quoting James Mitchell <jm...@apache.org>:
>
> I'm not sure how you want to handle the tests that require a database
> configuration and connection (??Craig??). They run fine for me with a
> simple mysql install.
How about if we create a test dependency on hsqldb (or some equivalent embedded
SQL database with a JDBC driver)? Since it runs in the same process, it could
be managed pretty much like any other test.
>
> As far as building/dist-ing, Maven is giving me fits. I am fighting with
> Maven to get it to do what I need (per last discussion about distributions
> and struts plugins, etc), but I'm just not that familiar with it.
>
I'm glad someone else is cutting their teeth on Maven building so I can just
benefit from their experience when it's done :-).
> I'm not complaining about Maven specifically, I just hate feeling stupid
> with this or any neat tool ;)
>
> Much like the discussions/arguments about jsp vs. velocity, Maven might be
> cool and might even be more powerful than Ant, but I am just not as
> knowledgable with Maven as I am with Ant build scripts.
>
> I'm going to move them to the main src directory, but I will need some
> assistence getting the tests to pass.
>
>
> --
> James Mitchell
> Software Engineer / Open Source Evangelist
> EdgeTech, Inc.
> 678.910.8017
> AIM: jmitchtx
> MSN: jmitchell@apache.org
>
Craig
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Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
Posted by James Mitchell <jm...@apache.org>.
That's great!!! Can you help? diff -u is the best way to submit patches.
Thanks in advance ;)
--
James Mitchell
Software Engineer / Open Source Evangelist
EdgeTech, Inc.
678.910.8017
AIM: jmitchtx
MSN: jmitchell@apache.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Eric Pugh" <ep...@upstate.com>
To: "'Jakarta Commons Developers List'" <co...@jakarta.apache.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 9:13 AM
Subject: RE: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
> I have used HSQL and/or mckoi quite successfully for running unit tests.
In
> [configuration] we have TestDatabaseConfiguration that demonstrates using
> DBUnit to populate an HSQLDB database, all in memory. An upcoming HSQLDB
> 1.7.2 will be even better at being used in memory, you'll be able to
specify
> that the database is to be totally in memory and not persist anythign...
>
> Eric
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: James Mitchell [mailto:jmitchell@apache.org]
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 12:33 PM
> > To: Jakarta Commons Developers List
> > Subject: Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
> >
> >
> >
> > I'm not sure how you want to handle the tests that require a database
> > configuration and connection (??Craig??). They run fine for me with a
> > simple mysql install.
> >
> > As far as building/dist-ing, Maven is giving me fits. I am
> > fighting with
> > Maven to get it to do what I need (per last discussion about
> > distributions
> > and struts plugins, etc), but I'm just not that familiar with it.
> >
> > I'm not complaining about Maven specifically, I just hate
> > feeling stupid
> > with this or any neat tool ;)
> >
> > Much like the discussions/arguments about jsp vs. velocity,
> > Maven might be
> > cool and might even be more powerful than Ant, but I am just not as
> > knowledgable with Maven as I am with Ant build scripts.
> >
> > I'm going to move them to the main src directory, but I will need some
> > assistence getting the tests to pass.
> >
> >
> > --
> > James Mitchell
> > Software Engineer / Open Source Evangelist
> > EdgeTech, Inc.
> > 678.910.8017
> > AIM: jmitchtx
> > MSN: jmitchell@apache.org
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Craig R. McClanahan" <cr...@apache.org>
> > To: "Jakarta Commons Developers List" <co...@jakarta.apache.org>
> > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 4:21 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
> >
> >
> > > Quoting Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org>:
> > >
> > > > The database implementations of Resources are currently
> > under a contrib
> > > > directory, which seems to imply that they are somehow second class
> > > > citizens to the other implementations. I'd prefer to see
> > them up there
> > > > with the best of them. ;-)
> > > >
> > > > Perhaps we could use a 'presence' test, as Chain does, to
> > determine
> > > > whether or not these pieces are built, and then integrate
> > them more
> > fully
> > > > into the Resources build?
> > > >
> > >
> > > +1 to both suggestions.
> > >
> > > > --
> > > > Martin Cooper
> > > >
> > >
> > > Craig
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
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RE: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
Posted by Eric Pugh <ep...@upstate.com>.
I have used HSQL and/or mckoi quite successfully for running unit tests. In
[configuration] we have TestDatabaseConfiguration that demonstrates using
DBUnit to populate an HSQLDB database, all in memory. An upcoming HSQLDB
1.7.2 will be even better at being used in memory, you'll be able to specify
that the database is to be totally in memory and not persist anythign...
Eric
> -----Original Message-----
> From: James Mitchell [mailto:jmitchell@apache.org]
> Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 12:33 PM
> To: Jakarta Commons Developers List
> Subject: Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
>
>
>
> I'm not sure how you want to handle the tests that require a database
> configuration and connection (??Craig??). They run fine for me with a
> simple mysql install.
>
> As far as building/dist-ing, Maven is giving me fits. I am
> fighting with
> Maven to get it to do what I need (per last discussion about
> distributions
> and struts plugins, etc), but I'm just not that familiar with it.
>
> I'm not complaining about Maven specifically, I just hate
> feeling stupid
> with this or any neat tool ;)
>
> Much like the discussions/arguments about jsp vs. velocity,
> Maven might be
> cool and might even be more powerful than Ant, but I am just not as
> knowledgable with Maven as I am with Ant build scripts.
>
> I'm going to move them to the main src directory, but I will need some
> assistence getting the tests to pass.
>
>
> --
> James Mitchell
> Software Engineer / Open Source Evangelist
> EdgeTech, Inc.
> 678.910.8017
> AIM: jmitchtx
> MSN: jmitchell@apache.org
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Craig R. McClanahan" <cr...@apache.org>
> To: "Jakarta Commons Developers List" <co...@jakarta.apache.org>
> Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 4:21 PM
> Subject: Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
>
>
> > Quoting Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org>:
> >
> > > The database implementations of Resources are currently
> under a contrib
> > > directory, which seems to imply that they are somehow second class
> > > citizens to the other implementations. I'd prefer to see
> them up there
> > > with the best of them. ;-)
> > >
> > > Perhaps we could use a 'presence' test, as Chain does, to
> determine
> > > whether or not these pieces are built, and then integrate
> them more
> fully
> > > into the Resources build?
> > >
> >
> > +1 to both suggestions.
> >
> > > --
> > > Martin Cooper
> > >
> >
> > Craig
> >
> >
> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> >
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
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Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
Posted by James Mitchell <jm...@apache.org>.
I'm not sure how you want to handle the tests that require a database
configuration and connection (??Craig??). They run fine for me with a
simple mysql install.
As far as building/dist-ing, Maven is giving me fits. I am fighting with
Maven to get it to do what I need (per last discussion about distributions
and struts plugins, etc), but I'm just not that familiar with it.
I'm not complaining about Maven specifically, I just hate feeling stupid
with this or any neat tool ;)
Much like the discussions/arguments about jsp vs. velocity, Maven might be
cool and might even be more powerful than Ant, but I am just not as
knowledgable with Maven as I am with Ant build scripts.
I'm going to move them to the main src directory, but I will need some
assistence getting the tests to pass.
--
James Mitchell
Software Engineer / Open Source Evangelist
EdgeTech, Inc.
678.910.8017
AIM: jmitchtx
MSN: jmitchell@apache.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig R. McClanahan" <cr...@apache.org>
To: "Jakarta Commons Developers List" <co...@jakarta.apache.org>
Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 4:21 PM
Subject: Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
> Quoting Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org>:
>
> > The database implementations of Resources are currently under a contrib
> > directory, which seems to imply that they are somehow second class
> > citizens to the other implementations. I'd prefer to see them up there
> > with the best of them. ;-)
> >
> > Perhaps we could use a 'presence' test, as Chain does, to determine
> > whether or not these pieces are built, and then integrate them more
fully
> > into the Resources build?
> >
>
> +1 to both suggestions.
>
> > --
> > Martin Cooper
> >
>
> Craig
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
Posted by "Craig R. McClanahan" <cr...@apache.org>.
Quoting Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org>:
> The database implementations of Resources are currently under a contrib
> directory, which seems to imply that they are somehow second class
> citizens to the other implementations. I'd prefer to see them up there
> with the best of them. ;-)
>
> Perhaps we could use a 'presence' test, as Chain does, to determine
> whether or not these pieces are built, and then integrate them more fully
> into the Resources build?
>
+1 to both suggestions.
> --
> Martin Cooper
>
Craig
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Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
Posted by David Graham <gr...@yahoo.com>.
--- Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org> wrote:
> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, David Graham wrote:
>
> > Wouldn't that require that the jars for each implementation be
> distributed
> > with commons-resources as well? There are quite a few jars for
> Hibernate
> > alone. IMO, contrib is the best place for them so we don't bloat the
> main
> > code base with each implementation. People can grab just the one they
> > need.
>
> There would be a single Resources jar, containing all implementations,
> but
> that doesn't mean that we distribute Hibernate or anything else along
> with
> it. (Commons Logging, for example, supports several different loggers,
> but
> doesn't distribute them.)
Where do we draw the line on which implementations to include in the
standard resources distro? Hibernate is a great library and the single
most popular Java persistence framework but it's not a standard or from
Apache. What about smaller XYZ implementations that aren't nearly as
widely used?
As long as we don't distribute Hibernate jars with commons resources I'm
ok with including it but we may choose to put every non-standard
implementation in contrib for simplicity.
David
>
> I just don't see a need to split off the DB implementations into
> something
> that seems second class.
>
> --
> Martin Cooper
>
>
> >
> > David
> >
> > --- Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org> wrote:
> > > The database implementations of Resources are currently under a
> contrib
> > > directory, which seems to imply that they are somehow second class
> > > citizens to the other implementations. I'd prefer to see them up
> there
> > > with the best of them. ;-)
> > >
> > > Perhaps we could use a 'presence' test, as Chain does, to determine
> > > whether or not these pieces are built, and then integrate them more
> > > fully
> > > into the Resources build?
> > >
> > > --
> > > Martin Cooper
> > >
> > >
> > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> > >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
>
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Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
Posted by Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org>.
On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, David Graham wrote:
> Wouldn't that require that the jars for each implementation be distributed
> with commons-resources as well? There are quite a few jars for Hibernate
> alone. IMO, contrib is the best place for them so we don't bloat the main
> code base with each implementation. People can grab just the one they
> need.
There would be a single Resources jar, containing all implementations, but
that doesn't mean that we distribute Hibernate or anything else along with
it. (Commons Logging, for example, supports several different loggers, but
doesn't distribute them.)
I just don't see a need to split off the DB implementations into something
that seems second class.
--
Martin Cooper
>
> David
>
> --- Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org> wrote:
> > The database implementations of Resources are currently under a contrib
> > directory, which seems to imply that they are somehow second class
> > citizens to the other implementations. I'd prefer to see them up there
> > with the best of them. ;-)
> >
> > Perhaps we could use a 'presence' test, as Chain does, to determine
> > whether or not these pieces are built, and then integrate them more
> > fully
> > into the Resources build?
> >
> > --
> > Martin Cooper
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> >
>
>
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Re: [Resources] Presence vs. contrib
Posted by David Graham <gr...@yahoo.com>.
Wouldn't that require that the jars for each implementation be distributed
with commons-resources as well? There are quite a few jars for Hibernate
alone. IMO, contrib is the best place for them so we don't bloat the main
code base with each implementation. People can grab just the one they
need.
David
--- Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org> wrote:
> The database implementations of Resources are currently under a contrib
> directory, which seems to imply that they are somehow second class
> citizens to the other implementations. I'd prefer to see them up there
> with the best of them. ;-)
>
> Perhaps we could use a 'presence' test, as Chain does, to determine
> whether or not these pieces are built, and then integrate them more
> fully
> into the Resources build?
>
> --
> Martin Cooper
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
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