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Posted to dev@subversion.apache.org by Greg Stein <gs...@collab.net> on 2002/01/08 20:54:19 UTC
RE: [Issue 524] Changed - line-ending conversion and keyword expansion
> From: issues@subversion.tigris.org [mailto:issues@subversion.tigris.org]
> Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2002 11:47 AM
> To: issues@subversion.tigris.org
> Subject: [Issue 524] Changed - line-ending conversion and keyword
expansion
>...
> + ------- Additional Comments From kfogel@tigris.org 2002-01-08
11:47 -------
> + Note that everyone will need to do fresh checkouts once this
> + is working, because (for committers, at least), the created-rev
> + data in their working copy's .svn/entries files may be wrong,
> + as it would be set for committed objects but never on updates.
> + That is, until we upgrade the server, it hasn't been sending
> + CR data back, so entries may have incorrect CR fields, among
> + other things.
Why should people do a fresh checkout? Wouldn't the only problem be that the
keyword substitutions are a bit "off"? I certainly don't mind.
Or will the substitution *require* that created-rev be in the entries file;
therefore, we must do a checkout to ensure that it gets there?
Cheers,
-g
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Re: [Issue 524] Changed - line-ending conversion and keyword expansion
Posted by Karl Fogel <kf...@newton.ch.collab.net>.
"Greg Stein" <gs...@collab.net> writes:
> You and Ben are missing my point. The issue seemed to say that people "must"
> do a fresh checkout. Seems that I could keep working quite fine with my
> existing WC.
>
> Yes, it will be "off" and whatnot, but so what?
Oh -- in your original mail, "off" meant "incorrect expansion"?
Yikes. :-)
Suit yourself, I guess. Those people who don't consider this to be
"working quite fine" will want to do a fresh checkout. We'll just
tell people the implications and let them decide.
-K
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Karl Fogel [mailto:kfogel@newton.ch.collab.net]
> > Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2002 2:03 PM
> > To: Greg Stein
> > Cc: dev@subversion.tigris.org
> > Subject: Re: [Issue 524] Changed - line-ending conversion and keyword
> > expansion
> >
> >
> > "Greg Stein" <gs...@collab.net> writes:
> > > Why should people do a fresh checkout? Wouldn't the only
> > problem be that the
> > > keyword substitutions are a bit "off"? I certainly don't mind.
> > >
> > > Or will the substitution *require* that created-rev be in the
> > entries file;
> > > therefore, we must do a checkout to ensure that it gets there?
> >
> > The problem will be that the `created-rev' attribute in the entries
> > will be present but wrong. So whether the substitution works when
> > `created-rev' is absent isn't the question -- the real issue is that
> > when created-rev is present but incorrect, then that keyword will get
> > expanded incorrectly as well.
> >
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Re: [Issue 524] Changed - line-ending conversion and keyword expansion
Posted by Ben Collins-Sussman <su...@collab.net>.
"Greg Stein" <gs...@collab.net> writes:
> You and Ben are missing my point. The issue seemed to say that people "must"
> do a fresh checkout. Seems that I could keep working quite fine with my
> existing WC.
>
> Yes, it will be "off" and whatnot, but so what?
There is no need to do a fresh checkout. Nothing will break in your
wc. Keyword expansion will yield either non-existent or incorrect
results, but these aren't show stoppers.
IOW, if a developer wishes to have *correctly working* keyword
expansion, they must do a fresh checkout. Otherwise, you can ignore
the feature for now.
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RE: [Issue 524] Changed - line-ending conversion and keyword expansion
Posted by Greg Stein <gs...@collab.net>.
You and Ben are missing my point. The issue seemed to say that people "must"
do a fresh checkout. Seems that I could keep working quite fine with my
existing WC.
Yes, it will be "off" and whatnot, but so what?
-g
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Karl Fogel [mailto:kfogel@newton.ch.collab.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2002 2:03 PM
> To: Greg Stein
> Cc: dev@subversion.tigris.org
> Subject: Re: [Issue 524] Changed - line-ending conversion and keyword
> expansion
>
>
> "Greg Stein" <gs...@collab.net> writes:
> > Why should people do a fresh checkout? Wouldn't the only
> problem be that the
> > keyword substitutions are a bit "off"? I certainly don't mind.
> >
> > Or will the substitution *require* that created-rev be in the
> entries file;
> > therefore, we must do a checkout to ensure that it gets there?
>
> The problem will be that the `created-rev' attribute in the entries
> will be present but wrong. So whether the substitution works when
> `created-rev' is absent isn't the question -- the real issue is that
> when created-rev is present but incorrect, then that keyword will get
> expanded incorrectly as well.
>
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Re: [Issue 524] Changed - line-ending conversion and keyword expansion
Posted by Karl Fogel <kf...@newton.ch.collab.net>.
"Greg Stein" <gs...@collab.net> writes:
> Why should people do a fresh checkout? Wouldn't the only problem be that the
> keyword substitutions are a bit "off"? I certainly don't mind.
>
> Or will the substitution *require* that created-rev be in the entries file;
> therefore, we must do a checkout to ensure that it gets there?
The problem will be that the `created-rev' attribute in the entries
will be present but wrong. So whether the substitution works when
`created-rev' is absent isn't the question -- the real issue is that
when created-rev is present but incorrect, then that keyword will get
expanded incorrectly as well.
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Re: [Issue 524] Changed - line-ending conversion and keyword expansion
Posted by Karl Fogel <kf...@newton.ch.collab.net>.
Ben Collins-Sussman <su...@collab.net> writes:
> I'm sure that we'll do graceful degradation. If a keyword value isn't
> in the entries file, then it will substitute to an empty string.
Meaning substitute to the unexpanded keyword, I'm assuming...
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Re: [Issue 524] Changed - line-ending conversion and keyword expansion
Posted by Ben Collins-Sussman <su...@collab.net>.
"Greg Stein" <gs...@collab.net> writes:
>
> Why should people do a fresh checkout? Wouldn't the only problem be that the
> keyword substitutions are a bit "off"? I certainly don't mind.
Isn't it kind of bad to have blatantly wrong keyword info attached to
a file's entry?
> Or will the substitution *require* that created-rev be in the
> entries file; therefore, we must do a checkout to ensure that it
> gets there?
I'm sure that we'll do graceful degradation. If a keyword value isn't
in the entries file, then it will substitute to an empty string.
But beyond that: we'd eventually like 'svn status' to make use of the
info, even if very few of us ever use keyword expansion. Someday I'd
like to have 'svn st' tell me the CR of a file, so I can immediately
update the file to revision CR-1. (We had to do that today, in fact.)
Someday I'd like status to tell me the last person who changed a file
too. Sure, it's all doable via 'svn log file', but it's nice to have
alternatives.
The point about keyword substitution: if you checkout a working copy
from a client/server combo later than r739, you are guaranteed that
the keyword info in your working copy will always be correct, and that
it will always be maintained correctly. If your working copy is
missing info, or if you update from a pre-r739 server, then you lose
that guarantee. As long as svn developers are willing to live without
this guarantee, that's fine. But they should be aware of the
tradeoff. (I mean, a fresh svn checkout isn't that big a deal.)
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