You are viewing a plain text version of this content. The canonical link for it is here.
Posted to users@cocoon.apache.org by Lars Huttar <la...@sil.org> on 2007/09/24 22:49:32 UTC
recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Hello,
We've been using Cocoon for a few years now. We've made lots of our own
modifications to cocoon.xconf (and the top-level sitemap).
Now whenever we want to update Cocoon, the changes to cocoon.xconf from
the update are very difficult to merge with our own changes without
breaking Cocoon.
What is the recommended way to keep local configuration changes separate
from changes in the distribution?
Does the method described at
http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/daisy/cocooninaction/14.html really work
well?
(using Ant and its XPatch task)
Thanks,
Lars
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Posted by Lars Huttar <la...@sil.org>.
On 9/25/2007 3:39 PM, Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> On 9/24/07, Lars Huttar <la...@sil.org> wrote:
>
>
>> ...What is the recommended way to keep local configuration changes separate
>> from changes in the distribution?
>> Does the method described at
>> http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/daisy/cocooninaction/14.html really work
>> well?
>> (using Ant and its XPatch task)...
>>
>
> It certainly works well for Cocoon 2.1.x, and if for some reason you
> want to keep using 2.1.x
Um... this makes it sound like there is some choice; but as far as I can
tell, 2.2 has not yet been released. Did I miss something?
On http://cocoon.apache.org/news/index.html, and the Projects / Cocoon
menu there, no version past 2.1.* is listed.
> you should also have a look at
> http://wiki.apache.org/cocoon/BricksCms which is a more integrated
> example of using ant + XPatch.
>
> -Bertrand
>
Thanks ... I will look into this.
Lars
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from Cocoon distributions
Posted by Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org>.
On 9/24/07, Lars Huttar <la...@sil.org> wrote:
> ...What is the recommended way to keep local configuration changes separate
> from changes in the distribution?
> Does the method described at
> http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/daisy/cocooninaction/14.html really work
> well?
> (using Ant and its XPatch task)...
It certainly works well for Cocoon 2.1.x, and if for some reason you
want to keep using 2.1.x you should also have a look at
http://wiki.apache.org/cocoon/BricksCms which is a more integrated
example of using ant + XPatch.
-Bertrand
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Posted by Grzegorz Kossakowski <gk...@apache.org>.
Raphaël Piéroni pisze:
> Hi,
Hi Raphaël
> About this marvelous documentation,
> Is there a way to get the whole 2.2 documentation in one pdf ?
Not yet but certainly we plan to do it.
--
Grzegorz Kossakowski
Committer and PMC Member of Apache Cocoon
http://reflectingonthevicissitudes.wordpress.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Posted by Raphaël Piéroni <ra...@aql.fr>.
Grzegorz Kossakowski a écrit :
> Lars Huttar pisze:
>
>> I appreciate the recommendation. I will be interested to look into
>> Cocoon 2.2.
>> However, production applications for our organization are running on
>> Cocoon. Can I justify the risk of using an alpha version of Cocoon for
>> production apps?
>>
>
> It's certainly not in alpha state, it has beta status for some time and there are people having big
> apps on top of 2.2. You can search archives of this list for people sharing their experiences.
>
>
>> Is Cocoon 2.2 to be released soon? (I found a blog entry from Sylvain
>> from March 2005 saying "it's very likely that the pressure will grow for
>> a release in the coming months...")
>>
>
> That shows we are bad at informing about our work but this is really going to change because we will
> switch to new site publishing mechanisms that make it a hell easier to update Cocoon site and keep
> everything relevant.
>
> The truth is that Reinhard Pötz is just about pushing Cocoon 2.2 RC2 and we are seriously thinking
> about releasing final 2.2 quite soon.
>
>
>> Also, does Cocoon 2.2 have sufficient documentation (both in general,
>> and regarding configuration handling)? Can you point me to documentation
>> on configuration handling?
>>
>
> I recommend to start with this[1] tutorial that will give you basic idea of real blocks that 2.2
> introduces. When it comes to configuration handling, there is no one big cocoon.xconf file any more
> and Cocoon's configuration is handled by Configuration[2] subproject (completely separate from
> Cocoon when it comes to dependencies). The most important part that makes real work of handling of
> configuration is Spring configurator[3].
>
> Thanks to Spring Configurator you can alter any existing configuration file (Spring bean definition)
> by using properties following some conventions. When it comes to extension points listing some other
> component (datasources, custom Forms widgets and so on) Spring Configurator offers very powerful
> bean-map that allows to collect all beans implementing particular interface dynamically so there is
> no central point of configuration that would have to be altered when new implementation arises.
>
> HTH.
>
> [1] http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/dev-docs/2.2/1159_1_1.html
> [2]
> http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/dev-docs/subprojects/configuration/configuration-api/1.0/1314_1_1.html
> [3]
> http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/dev-docs/subprojects/configuration/spring-configurator/1.0/1304_1_1.html
>
>
Hi,
About this marvelous documentation,
Is there a way to get the whole 2.2 documentation in one pdf ?
Regards,
Raphaël
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Posted by Lars Huttar <la...@sil.org>.
On 9/28/2007 5:27 PM, Grzegorz Kossakowski wrote:
> Lars Huttar pisze:
>
>> Understandable...
>> but that doesn't sound like a beta release to me, if it was never
>> announced as such.
>>
>> Not to be critical ... I'm just trying to gauge the risk factor of
>> diving into Cocoon 2.2 for our production apps,
>>
>
> If I was the one giving advice I would suggest to just play with Cocoon 2.2 non-committally at the
> beginning. As soon as you discover that Cocoon 2.2 brings a lot of features that you will start to
> consider as must-have ones I'm sure you get more confidence in Cocoon 2.2 :-)
>
No doubt. :-)
The addition of useful new features is important.
What I'm looking for is confidence that in 2.2, essential old features
are not missing / broken / undocumented.
> AFAIK, registration for Cocoon GT 2007[1] is still open so you may consider attending this event.
> I'm sure it's going to be the best occasion to see where Cocoon heads and how to keep up with its
> advances.
>
That does seem like a good idea. It's probably too late for me this year
(in terms of arranging funding and buying tickets), but I hope to go
next year.
I keep hoping there might be a GT in North America, but it seems to be a
European thing so far.
>
>> given that Grzegorz said
>>
>>> It's certainly not in alpha state, it has beta status for some time
>>> and there are people having big
>>> apps on top of 2.2. You can search archives of this list for people
>>> sharing their experiences.
>>>
>> I see a lot of very smart people working on Cocoon, and putting lots of
>> deep thought into it.
>> It's also my favorite web app framework, and we have a lot of time,
>> code, and learning invested in it.
>> But the continued track record of important knowledge never quite making
>> it out to an official, public site tends to sap one's confidence.
>> :-(
>>
>
> What a good timing you have! I mean, you surely will be interested in this[2] e-mail from Reinhard
> written today. :-)
>
>
Great! I will be looking over this with anticipation.
> I hope that some confidence has been restored.
>
Yes.
Thanks for humoring me...
Lars
> [1] http://www.cocoongt.org/
> [2] http://article.gmane.org/gmane.text.xml.cocoon.devel/75440
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Posted by Grzegorz Kossakowski <gk...@apache.org>.
Lars Huttar pisze:
> Understandable...
> but that doesn't sound like a beta release to me, if it was never
> announced as such.
>
> Not to be critical ... I'm just trying to gauge the risk factor of
> diving into Cocoon 2.2 for our production apps,
If I was the one giving advice I would suggest to just play with Cocoon 2.2 non-committally at the
beginning. As soon as you discover that Cocoon 2.2 brings a lot of features that you will start to
consider as must-have ones I'm sure you get more confidence in Cocoon 2.2 :-)
AFAIK, registration for Cocoon GT 2007[1] is still open so you may consider attending this event.
I'm sure it's going to be the best occasion to see where Cocoon heads and how to keep up with its
advances.
> given that Grzegorz said
>> It's certainly not in alpha state, it has beta status for some time
>> and there are people having big
>> apps on top of 2.2. You can search archives of this list for people
>> sharing their experiences.
> I see a lot of very smart people working on Cocoon, and putting lots of
> deep thought into it.
> It's also my favorite web app framework, and we have a lot of time,
> code, and learning invested in it.
> But the continued track record of important knowledge never quite making
> it out to an official, public site tends to sap one's confidence.
> :-(
What a good timing you have! I mean, you surely will be interested in this[2] e-mail from Reinhard
written today. :-)
I hope that some confidence has been restored.
[1] http://www.cocoongt.org/
[2] http://article.gmane.org/gmane.text.xml.cocoon.devel/75440
--
Grzegorz Kossakowski
Committer and PMC Member of Apache Cocoon
http://reflectingonthevicissitudes.wordpress.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Posted by Lars Huttar <la...@sil.org>.
On 9/27/2007 8:21 PM, Joerg Heinicke wrote:
> On 27.09.2007 18:17 Uhr, Lars Huttar wrote:
>
>> I see a lot of questions and bug reports about 2.2; but I suppose
>> that's to be expected from a mailing list.
>> Was there ever an announcement of 2.2RC1 being released? (I see a lot
>> of discussion about it on the dev list, up to July 2, but I don't see
>> an announcement.)
>
> No, there was never an announcement, mainly because of the lacking
> documentation. The reasoning for this probably reads: people that are
> aware of 2.2 RC1 by following the dev list also know about the lack of
> the documentation and get things done either on their own or with help
> from the dev list. Other people might just have been to upset or
> frustrated with RC1.
>
> Joerg
Understandable...
but that doesn't sound like a beta release to me, if it was never
announced as such.
Not to be critical ... I'm just trying to gauge the risk factor of
diving into Cocoon 2.2 for our production apps, given that Grzegorz said
> It's certainly not in alpha state, it has beta status for some time and there are people having big
> apps on top of 2.2. You can search archives of this list for people sharing their experiences.
I see a lot of very smart people working on Cocoon, and putting lots of
deep thought into it.
It's also my favorite web app framework, and we have a lot of time,
code, and learning invested in it.
But the continued track record of important knowledge never quite making
it out to an official, public site tends to sap one's confidence.
:-(
Oh well. Guess you can't have it all, in this world!
Lars
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Posted by Joerg Heinicke <jo...@gmx.de>.
On 27.09.2007 18:17 Uhr, Lars Huttar wrote:
> I see a lot of questions and bug reports about 2.2; but I suppose that's
> to be expected from a mailing list.
> Was there ever an announcement of 2.2RC1 being released? (I see a lot of
> discussion about it on the dev list, up to July 2, but I don't see an
> announcement.)
No, there was never an announcement, mainly because of the lacking
documentation. The reasoning for this probably reads: people that are
aware of 2.2 RC1 by following the dev list also know about the lack of
the documentation and get things done either on their own or with help
from the dev list. Other people might just have been to upset or
frustrated with RC1.
Joerg
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Posted by Lars Huttar <la...@sil.org>.
Grzegorz, thanks for your reply.
On 9/26/2007 3:27 PM, Grzegorz Kossakowski wrote:
> Lars Huttar pisze:
>
>> I appreciate the recommendation. I will be interested to look into
>> Cocoon 2.2.
>> However, production applications for our organization are running on
>> Cocoon. Can I justify the risk of using an alpha version of Cocoon for
>> production apps?
>>
>
> It's certainly not in alpha state, it has beta status for some time and there are people having big
> apps on top of 2.2.
OK. That's good to know.
I searched the Cocoon web sites as best I could, e.g.
http://cocoon.apache.org/2.1/plan/overview/roadmap.html, and JIRA
(http://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/COCOON?report=com.sourcelabs.jira.plugin.portlet.releases:releases-projecttab),
and could not find information about a beta release of 2.2.
> You can search archives of this list for people sharing their experiences.
>
I see a lot of questions and bug reports about 2.2; but I suppose that's
to be expected from a mailing list.
Was there ever an announcement of 2.2RC1 being released? (I see a lot of
discussion about it on the dev list, up to July 2, but I don't see an
announcement.)
>> Is Cocoon 2.2 to be released soon? (I found a blog entry from Sylvain
>> from March 2005 saying "it's very likely that the pressure will grow for
>> a release in the coming months...")
>>
>
> That shows we are bad at informing about our work but this is really going to change because we will
> switch to new site publishing mechanisms that make it a hell easier to update Cocoon site and keep
> everything relevant.
>
> The truth is that Reinhard Pötz is just about pushing Cocoon 2.2 RC2 and we are seriously thinking
> about releasing final 2.2 quite soon.
>
>
>> Also, does Cocoon 2.2 have sufficient documentation (both in general,
>> and regarding configuration handling)? Can you point me to documentation
>> on configuration handling?
>>
>
> I recommend to start with this[1] tutorial that will give you basic idea of real blocks that 2.2
> introduces. When it comes to configuration handling, there is no one big cocoon.xconf file any more
> and Cocoon's configuration is handled by Configuration[2] subproject (completely separate from
> Cocoon when it comes to dependencies). The most important part that makes real work of handling of
> configuration is Spring configurator[3].
>
> Thanks to Spring Configurator you can alter any existing configuration file (Spring bean definition)
> by using properties following some conventions. When it comes to extension points listing some other
> component (datasources, custom Forms widgets and so on) Spring Configurator offers very powerful
> bean-map that allows to collect all beans implementing particular interface dynamically so there is
> no central point of configuration that would have to be altered when new implementation arises.
>
> HTH.
>
> [1] http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/dev-docs/2.2/1159_1_1.html
> [2]
> http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/dev-docs/subprojects/configuration/configuration-api/1.0/1314_1_1.html
> [3]
> http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/dev-docs/subprojects/configuration/spring-configurator/1.0/1304_1_1.html
>
Thanks.
Lars
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Posted by Grzegorz Kossakowski <gk...@apache.org>.
Lars Huttar pisze:
> I appreciate the recommendation. I will be interested to look into
> Cocoon 2.2.
> However, production applications for our organization are running on
> Cocoon. Can I justify the risk of using an alpha version of Cocoon for
> production apps?
It's certainly not in alpha state, it has beta status for some time and there are people having big
apps on top of 2.2. You can search archives of this list for people sharing their experiences.
> Is Cocoon 2.2 to be released soon? (I found a blog entry from Sylvain
> from March 2005 saying "it's very likely that the pressure will grow for
> a release in the coming months...")
That shows we are bad at informing about our work but this is really going to change because we will
switch to new site publishing mechanisms that make it a hell easier to update Cocoon site and keep
everything relevant.
The truth is that Reinhard Pötz is just about pushing Cocoon 2.2 RC2 and we are seriously thinking
about releasing final 2.2 quite soon.
> Also, does Cocoon 2.2 have sufficient documentation (both in general,
> and regarding configuration handling)? Can you point me to documentation
> on configuration handling?
I recommend to start with this[1] tutorial that will give you basic idea of real blocks that 2.2
introduces. When it comes to configuration handling, there is no one big cocoon.xconf file any more
and Cocoon's configuration is handled by Configuration[2] subproject (completely separate from
Cocoon when it comes to dependencies). The most important part that makes real work of handling of
configuration is Spring configurator[3].
Thanks to Spring Configurator you can alter any existing configuration file (Spring bean definition)
by using properties following some conventions. When it comes to extension points listing some other
component (datasources, custom Forms widgets and so on) Spring Configurator offers very powerful
bean-map that allows to collect all beans implementing particular interface dynamically so there is
no central point of configuration that would have to be altered when new implementation arises.
HTH.
[1] http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/dev-docs/2.2/1159_1_1.html
[2]
http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/dev-docs/subprojects/configuration/configuration-api/1.0/1314_1_1.html
[3]
http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/dev-docs/subprojects/configuration/spring-configurator/1.0/1304_1_1.html
--
Grzegorz Kossakowski
Committer and PMC Member of Apache Cocoon
http://reflectingonthevicissitudes.wordpress.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Posted by Lars Huttar <la...@sil.org>.
On 9/25/2007 3:18 PM, Grzegorz Kossakowski wrote:
> Lars Huttar pisze:
>
>> Hello,
>> We've been using Cocoon for a few years now. We've made lots of our own
>> modifications to cocoon.xconf (and the top-level sitemap).
>> Now whenever we want to update Cocoon, the changes to cocoon.xconf from
>> the update are very difficult to merge with our own changes without
>> breaking Cocoon.
>>
>> What is the recommended way to keep local configuration changes separate
>> from changes in the distribution?
>> Does the method described at
>> http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/daisy/cocooninaction/14.html really work
>> well?
>> (using Ant and its XPatch task)
>>
>
> >From what you said I guess you are talking about Cocoon 2.1.x. Handling of configuration was one of
> the most annoying weakness of 2.1.x that make me interested in 2.2 some really long time ago.
> Techniques that you refer to worked for me to some extent and they seem to be the best options for
> 2.1.x.
>
> Anyway, I strongly recommend taking a look at Cocoon 2.2 that is a major leap when it comes to
> modularization and configuration handling of applications based on Cocoon.
>
I appreciate the recommendation. I will be interested to look into
Cocoon 2.2.
However, production applications for our organization are running on
Cocoon. Can I justify the risk of using an alpha version of Cocoon for
production apps?
Is Cocoon 2.2 to be released soon? (I found a blog entry from Sylvain
from March 2005 saying "it's very likely that the pressure will grow for
a release in the coming months...")
Also, does Cocoon 2.2 have sufficient documentation (both in general,
and regarding configuration handling)? Can you point me to documentation
on configuration handling?
Thanks,
Lars
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org
Re: recommended way to keep local config modifications separate from
Cocoon distributions
Posted by Grzegorz Kossakowski <gk...@apache.org>.
Lars Huttar pisze:
> Hello,
> We've been using Cocoon for a few years now. We've made lots of our own
> modifications to cocoon.xconf (and the top-level sitemap).
> Now whenever we want to update Cocoon, the changes to cocoon.xconf from
> the update are very difficult to merge with our own changes without
> breaking Cocoon.
>
> What is the recommended way to keep local configuration changes separate
> from changes in the distribution?
> Does the method described at
> http://cocoon.zones.apache.org/daisy/cocooninaction/14.html really work
> well?
> (using Ant and its XPatch task)
>From what you said I guess you are talking about Cocoon 2.1.x. Handling of configuration was one of
the most annoying weakness of 2.1.x that make me interested in 2.2 some really long time ago.
Techniques that you refer to worked for me to some extent and they seem to be the best options for
2.1.x.
Anyway, I strongly recommend taking a look at Cocoon 2.2 that is a major leap when it comes to
modularization and configuration handling of applications based on Cocoon.
--
Grzegorz Kossakowski
Committer and PMC Member of Apache Cocoon
http://reflectingonthevicissitudes.wordpress.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@cocoon.apache.org