Re: Incubator WAS: Project Proposal?

[Brett Porter <br...@apache.org>]

Torsten Curdt wrote:

>
> Well, AFAIU the incubator is also about establishing a community
> not only about legal safety - so that would apply here as well.
>
> ...but the whole progress might be a bit too much for a little
> library project. That's why the commons sandbox still makes
> sense. It's about smaller components NOT on the project level.

Well, I think the point was that this particular project wasn't a
library project, so not suited for commons.

However, given Noel's email on commons-exec, I think it would be good to
talk about the similarities of the sandbox and the incubator and
determine if both are needed and how they can help each other.

>
> But maybe it would be worth discussing the whole internally
> sponsored projects idea over at incubator. WDTY?

I'm pretty sure that this can happen, and has happenened before. It is
not always necessary, as the committers may be able to start it under
their current project and later if it grows a community of its own look
for promotion to Jakarta of Apache (such as what Maven did from Turbine,
or Ant from Tomcat).

- Brett

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RE: Incubator WAS: Project Proposal?

["Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>]

Brett Porter wrote:

> given Noel's email on commons-exec, I think it would be good to
> talk about the similarities of the sandbox and the incubator and
> determine if both are needed and how they can help each other.

They are probably both needed, since the sandbox is typically used for
internal projects that are just not ready for prime time.  But the sandbox
cannot be used as a stand-in for the Incubator.

I think that everyone realizes that new communities must be come through the
Incubator, but it may not be as widely understood that external codebases
imported into existing projects must still be recorded in the Incubator.

See:
http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/site-author/projects/
ip-clearance-template.html

	--- Noel


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RE: Incubator WAS: Project Proposal?

["Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>]

Torsten Curdt wrote:

> ...I just wanted to point out that incubator not only exists
> due to legal reasons. (actually I am not sure if that was the
> main in reason in the first place at all) If it was, we would
> not need it for internally started projects.

Actually, we don't need to use it for internally started projects.  But we
most certainly have to use it for things coming in from the outside.

> But to my understanding it is also about establishing a healthy community.

Absolutely.  When we are bringing in external projects, we need to make sure
that they become a healthy community following ASF practices.

However, when we are bringing in external codebases into an existing
project, we still need to use the Incubator.  Rule of thumb: if you need a
Software Grant, you should be recording it in the Incubator as per the IP
template.

	--- Noel


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Re: Incubator WAS: Project Proposal?

[Torsten Curdt <tc...@vafer.org>]

>> Well, AFAIU the incubator is also about establishing a community
>> not only about legal safety - so that would apply here as well.
>>
>> ...but the whole progress might be a bit too much for a little
>> library project. That's why the commons sandbox still makes
>> sense. It's about smaller components NOT on the project level.
>>
>
> Well, I think the point was that this particular project wasn't a
> library project, so not suited for commons.

Sorry my writing was misleading

...I just wanted to point out that
incubator not only exists due to
legal reasons. (actually I am not
sure if that was the main in reason
in the first place at all)
If it was, we would not need it
for internally started projects.

But to my understanding it is also
about establishing a healthy community.
So it does also make sense for
internally sponsored projects.
...given they have a reasonable
size.

So coming back to the original
topic of the thread

So it's a framework?

Yeah - incubator does make sense (to me)
...altough there are no legal issues.

cheers
--
Torsten