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Posted to ivy-user@ant.apache.org by CBy <iv...@byrman.demon.nl> on 2010/02/07 16:33:48 UTC

Why should I use a dependencies manager?

Hi,

I like to setup my projects in such a way that new users can check them 
out from our subversion repository and are ready to go. For managing 
dependencies, I have been experimenting with both Maven Ant Tasks and 
Ivy. Now that I have to choose between them, I seem to have forgotten 
why I started this exercise in the first place. Granted, checking in 
log4j and other libraries that I use in almost every project is not very 
efficient, but who cares? It's simple, has none of the bootstrapping 
problems, and disk space is not really a concern nowadays. I like 
simple. Is there a compelling reason not to do it this way? (I've read 
the FAQ, but was not really convinced so far.)

CBy

Re: Why should I use a dependencies manager?

Posted by Richard Hauswald <ri...@googlemail.com>.

Imagine the case you want to remove a dependency with 20 dependencies
itself. Now go hunting for the jar files of the 50 jars in your lib
folder - oh and don't remove shared dependencies...

On Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 4:42 PM, Hugo Pinto <hs...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Cby,
>
> Just think about projects which use subprojects which have
> dependencies not compatible with the parent project's dependencies(or
> deprecated versions of common libraries) and you've got a case where
> you need to manage your dependencies formally.
>
> If you have a single project it may be overkill(*); have many projects
> that may be combined or have dependencies between them and you will
> need some sort of dependency management.
>
> (*) I use for all my projects though, as in practice I use so many
> framweworks as to always fall into the case of a "project that uses
> other projects that have umpredictable dependencies"
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Hugo Pinto
> Artificial Intelligence, Computational Linguistics and Computer Games
> http://www.hugopinto.net
>
> 2010/2/7 CBy <iv...@byrman.demon.nl>:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I like to setup my projects in such a way that new users can check them out
>> from our subversion repository and are ready to go. For managing
>> dependencies, I have been experimenting with both Maven Ant Tasks and Ivy.
>> Now that I have to choose between them, I seem to have forgotten why I
>> started this exercise in the first place. Granted, checking in log4j and
>> other libraries that I use in almost every project is not very efficient,
>> but who cares? It's simple, has none of the bootstrapping problems, and disk
>> space is not really a concern nowadays. I like simple. Is there a compelling
>> reason not to do it this way? (I've read the FAQ, but was not really
>> convinced so far.)
>>
>> CBy
>>
>



-- 
Richard Hauswald
Blog: http://tnfstacc.blogspot.com/
LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/richardhauswald
Xing: http://www.xing.com/profile/Richard_Hauswald

Re: Why should I use a dependencies manager?

Posted by Hugo Pinto <hs...@gmail.com>.

Hi Cby,

Just think about projects which use subprojects which have
dependencies not compatible with the parent project's dependencies(or
deprecated versions of common libraries) and you've got a case where
you need to manage your dependencies formally.

If you have a single project it may be overkill(*); have many projects
that may be combined or have dependencies between them and you will
need some sort of dependency management.

(*) I use for all my projects though, as in practice I use so many
framweworks as to always fall into the case of a "project that uses
other projects that have umpredictable dependencies"

Cheers,
-- 
Hugo Pinto
Artificial Intelligence, Computational Linguistics and Computer Games
http://www.hugopinto.net

2010/2/7 CBy <iv...@byrman.demon.nl>:
> Hi,
>
> I like to setup my projects in such a way that new users can check them out
> from our subversion repository and are ready to go. For managing
> dependencies, I have been experimenting with both Maven Ant Tasks and Ivy.
> Now that I have to choose between them, I seem to have forgotten why I
> started this exercise in the first place. Granted, checking in log4j and
> other libraries that I use in almost every project is not very efficient,
> but who cares? It's simple, has none of the bootstrapping problems, and disk
> space is not really a concern nowadays. I like simple. Is there a compelling
> reason not to do it this way? (I've read the FAQ, but was not really
> convinced so far.)
>
> CBy
>

Re: Why should I use a dependencies manager?

Posted by Dave Brosius <db...@mebigfatguy.com>.

Two admittedly weak arguments are:

1) It's self documenting. It's easier to know what versions of what 3rd 
party libs you are using
2) It's easier to upgrade to a newer version.



CBy wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I like to setup my projects in such a way that new users can check 
> them out from our subversion repository and are ready to go. For 
> managing dependencies, I have been experimenting with both Maven Ant 
> Tasks and Ivy. Now that I have to choose between them, I seem to have 
> forgotten why I started this exercise in the first place. Granted, 
> checking in log4j and other libraries that I use in almost every 
> project is not very efficient, but who cares? It's simple, has none of 
> the bootstrapping problems, and disk space is not really a concern 
> nowadays. I like simple. Is there a compelling reason not to do it 
> this way? (I've read the FAQ, but was not really convinced so far.)
>
> CBy
>
>

Re: Why should I use a dependencies manager?

Posted by CBy <iv...@byrman.demon.nl>.

On 8-2-2010 17:05, Archief Cobbs wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 8, 2010 at 3:56 AM, Ben Evans<be...@db.com>  wrote:
>
>    
>> There's no better teacher than having to manually sort out the mess that
>> occurs from a project which was "too simple" to need automated dependency
>> management. (See also: "Too simple to need source control").
>>
>>      
> Ha! So true.
>
> -Archie
>
>    

Yes, I expected some response on my slightly provocative question... I 
was being serious though.
Thank you all for sharing your view. I think I am back on track again.

Re: Why should I use a dependencies manager?

Posted by Archie Cobbs <ar...@gmail.com>.

On Mon, Feb 8, 2010 at 3:56 AM, Ben Evans <be...@db.com> wrote:

> There's no better teacher than having to manually sort out the mess that
> occurs from a project which was "too simple" to need automated dependency
> management. (See also: "Too simple to need source control").
>

Ha! So true.

-Archie

-- 
Archie L. Cobbs

Re: Why should I use a dependencies manager?

Posted by Ben Evans <be...@db.com>.

Hi CBy,

Personally, I recommend that you go ahead and not use a dependency manager
for this project.

There's no better teacher than having to manually sort out the mess that
occurs from a project which was "too simple" to need automated dependency
management. (See also: "Too simple to need source control").

Thanks,

Ben
--
Ben Evans
eFX Algorithmic Trading
Deutsche Bank, London
Office: +44 (0)20 7541 3953

CBy <iv...@byrman.demon.nl>
07/02/2010 15:33
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